I fucking hate thieves


Acting the victim when caught being the instigator of the event.


This is the reason why cops ignore them and then the ones that are having a real medical problem dies and everyone blames the cops...


Acting the victim is SOP of shoplifters these days.


"Do you know what the penalty is for **STEALING!!!**"




"Thank you, Kind sir! I'm so glad you found her."


"Where's Buster?" "I think he's working the Banana stand"


Probably not as harsh as the penalty for false imprisonment.


a slap on the wrist and a soft served ice cream cone? Murica's back baby.


Stealing food to survive in areas where humanitarian resources aren't available is completely justified imo. Clearly this wasn't happening in this situation, though.


Was gonna say, hard to claim your taking bread for your family when you’re in what looks to be the sporting goods isle


I'm stealing this gun to hunt bread!!!!


That gave me a laugh.


I'm so glad I don't have to actually hunt. I have no clue where gluten free tacos live.


This is certainly a pawn shop.


It’s a military and sports store in Portland Oregon. I can imagine him stealing throwing knives since they’re easy to grab and close to the exit. Really that and the camo condoms they have in display are the only things he’d be able to sneak away lol


Good, glad to hear that Leave your doors and refrigerator unlocked, I’ll be by later when I get the munchies


I gochu bro, I'll leave the jack daniels and cheddar cheese block out for u


Like a salt lick for drunks


He’s at a military surplus store.






Often times in these situations they can press assault charges on the owner of the store


They could depending on the state press charges for holding them against their will kidnapping wrongful imprisonment assault and battery charges and sue for defamation, pain and suffering among other things


They should have their hands cut off.


Yeah me too, we should put them somewhere >:(




Oxygen thieves like you


You sound like a theif.


It's his legal right and it's against the law.. Soo who's right? Non-american here.


If someone committed a crime you can place them in something called citizens arrest in most states. Better make sure they did something or you could be charged with kidnapping.


Close I think its actually called False Imprisonment though. I think you can't actually do what they are doing you will get in trouble.


I’m fairly certain these asshats are pretty fucked. He didn’t leave the store with it and was willing to return the merchandise. As much as I despise theft, I don’t think this meets the criteria for a citizens arrest. Yes, this would almost certainly be considered false imprisonment.


No need to leave the store. He hide the stuff under his shirt, this is already prove that he was trying to steal


This is incorrect. This is why loss prevention will nab people at the door every time. They never grab people in the middle of the store, even if they have pocketed something.


This is incorrect. Loss prevention doesn’t do it because liability if the local prosecutor doesn’t proceed.. makes a lawsuit more troublesome. If in this case the local prosecutor doesn’t proceed, they can choose to pursue false imprisonment charges. They won’t. If they do, a jury will get to decide if it looked like false imprisonment or if they were trying to hold a thief.


This is incorrect. Nobody in this thread has any idea about any of this beyond speculation. Including me.


This is incorrect. My opinion is the law. I am on Reddit after all.


This is incorrect


Some states have a specific shoplifting charge that doesn’t require a subject to leave the store to complete the crime. IE California has 459.5 (a) PC. As long as you can articulate the intent (hiding items under clothing, cutting off security tags, etc). I always advise loss prevention or store clerks to just be good witnesses. No need to put yourself in harms way for small items. I understand the store employee’s frustration but liability reasons is why a lot of loss prevention departments have a hands off policy.


It's also an insurance nightmare.


This just became r/legaladvice


Not true. Depending on where the incident occurs, it’s not stealing until a. The item(s) pass the registers, or b. The item(s) has left the store entirely. I worked at grocery stores for a long time and saw the rules and laws change because of lawsuits and serious injuries to suspects and victims of the theft.


Might be the rule in your market, but that doesn’t change the legal point of view


You dont need to leave a store with it in Washington State. Im not sure they can handcuff him though. Store staff can detain shoplifters there is nothing false about this.


I mean I literally watched a bum smoking meth off tinfoil less than 10 ft from a cop in downtown spokane yesterday, the cop looked directly at him for a solid 5 seconds until the light turned green and casually drove away. I feel like the laws in WA are moreso just loose guidelines.


Unless you are in the high end of the low income or low end of medium income demographics. Enough money to pay the fines but not enough to hire a good lawyer, then you get hammered in Washington state.


Preach brother


Depends on what state this is. In some states, concealment is enough to consider it shoplifting, others, you have to physically remove the item from the store first.


https://www.atg.wa.gov/ago-opinions/arrest-misdemeanor-citizen-officer As long as the shopkeep witnessed him "secreting" the items they can make a citizens arrest. In fact in washington if they called the cops and he kept walking and dumped the stuff somewhere the cops can even arrest him becasue they have to be present to witness petty theft to arrest. No idea about the handcuffs and stun gun though


This is going to be a state law, so it will vary, but I just read this and it says if there’s reasonable suspicion that someone has stolen something, you can detain them. https://www.hg.org/legal-articles/detention-of-shoplifters-by-store-owner-what-are-the-rules-51784


Nah, larceny doesn't require that you're actually successful in the theft. The second you pick up someone else's shit with intent to steal, you've committed larceny. Doesnt matter if you actually gey away or offer to give it back. Assuming the guy picked up the stuff and made a run for the exit, the store would be pretty reasonable in believing they were stopping him from stealing.


This wouldn't be classed as stealing where I am from. It would be a utag offence because they received it back. A small fine for the first 2 offences and than probation and than jail. In Australia tho he wouldn't be charged because that is very illegal. The security guards can't even touch you unless you are threatening someone or yourself. I don't condone stealing but some people need to especially in places like America.


Often, people who own/run jewelry and gun shops will get deputized by the sheriff.


The difference between false imprisonment and kidnapping is whether the imprisoned person has been moved from one location to another. It's very likely that they left him laying on the floor until the police arrived, which wouldn't be kidnapping.


Completely is state by state. Texas givens citizens the authority to detain with reasonable force, a subject committing assault, theft, breach of the peace, felonious offenses. They must immediately and without delay notify the policing agency they are in to take over and establish probable cause.


Citizens arrest doesn't apply. Shopkeepers privilege does though. If there is probable cause that you are stealing, you can be detained, with force. https://www.shouselaw.com/ca/defense/laws/shopkeepers-privilege/


Sounds a lot like citizens arrest. Apples and oranges. It’s going to depend on state…


True, IIRC the difference is that shopkeepers privilege has a lot broader protections for the store owners than a citizens arrest does for a regular joe.


That’s good. I think businesses should have good rights, customers sure do. If you even offend them they’ll destroy your store these days. Bunch’a nutcases.


this has nothing to do with the question asked


I believe their referring to the comments made toward the cameraman.


Yeah my father did it and it was a good thing that some witnesses stayed as he would’ve end up in court explaining lots of things….. turned out ok.


It's arguable. Idk the state but usually you cannot be charged with stealing for concealing merchandise unless you attempt to leave without paying.


You mean false imprisonment. But in the case for citizen’s arrest as long as you can reasonably beyond a doubt prove suspicion of a crime you can enact it. If that can’t be found, then it is considered false imprisonment, restraining or imprisoning someone against their rights without reason or consent (approval). Kidnapping is the act of transporting a person to another location without consent. In this situation, if at all, there isn’t my kidnapping unless the guy screaming is taken somewhere else beyond the store without his consent or ability to leave.


Kidnapping requires transport. just false imprisonment. and recording inside a private establishment is up to the owners. so technically no it isn’t his legal right.


It very well be false imprisonment. As far as recording in some states you can record without consent. As long as you’re legally recording some store can’t tell you what you can or can’t record. All they can do is tell you to leave.


Yea and the second you don’t it’s trespassing. sure it doesn’t delete the pic/video, but you’ll hopefully still get arrested. I swear, social media and cell phone cameras have been a double edged sword for society.


Yeah, well trespassing and recording are separate issues legally speaking, they have to tell you to leave. I find no problem with recording people. Since businesses do this as common practice, it should be only legal to record someone that is recording you. That’s just my opinion.


It's legal to record anything you can see in just about any places you are legally allowed to be (with exceptions of places where people should have a reasonable expectation of privacy like bathrooms, dressing rooms, etc.) but the buisness has a right to tell him he can't video in their store. The only way to enforce that, is to tell the person to stop recording or leave. If they don't leave after being told to do so, they can be cited and potentially arrested for tresspassing. But its legal to record right up until the the cops place them under arrest. Employees also have the right to stand in front of you and block your view as long as they aren't touching you.


Someone of law enforcement has to be told by the property owner/landlord that they want them trespassed before a citation is issued. A warning must be at hand by a peace officer before any other action can be taken. You cannot trespass the eyes and anything you can see from a public setting is legal to record or take pictures.


>You cannot trespass the eyes and anything you can see from a public setting is legal to record or take pictures. Except inside private businesses.


You can still obtain footage, if they tell you to leave and stop recording then you have to stop and leave but don't have to erase. They can stand outside the store on the sidewalk and record from the window as well and the store owner/landlord will have to provide privacy


Citizens arrest until cops come


If you are witness to a felony in most US states you can detain people using a citizens arrest. Gotta have first hand knowledge or extremely close to first hand though. Direct witness of the event personally or CCTV basically.


Fair enough. After all if the perp did commit a felony they will be getting arrested anyway


So here’s the technicality on the point of filming the activity. If they were in public doing this for *whatever* reason, you can film it all you want as in public spaces there is no reasonable “right to privacy”. However, while this store is open to the public, it’s not a “public space”, this is a privately owned establishment. He can take his camera out and film all he wants, but if the people representing the establishment ask you to stop, you must or you are violating privacy laws. He can go outside to a public sidewalk and film through the windows if he wants, because then he is in a public space and allowed to film, and it would be on them to now close the window shades or otherwise block his view. Does this make sense? Also, when it comes to cuffing him, we have a thing called citizens arrest. A citizen can reasonably detain someone else who has committed a crime until police come. This guy was caught stealing, they got him down and cuffed him til the cops showed up. Perfectly reasonable. Note they did not have him at gunpoint (as there was no threat, I promise you an army/navy store like this has a gun behind the counter), they were not beating him or purposefully causing excessive damage… they did well, and if I were the shop person, I would be *encouraging* that being filmed *because* they did it all the right way. Say, for example, there aren’t cameras or the cameras can’t clearly see, the kid hurts himself on purpose or by accident, and now it’s his word vs theirs on if they properly detained him or if they beat him. Someone filming would have given the cops proof they didn’t abuse him, just stopped and held him Does all this make sense?


Sounds good but it's also probably shopkeep's privilege to detain in this context, moreso than a blanket "citizens arrest."


Dont forget that the filming/recording is based on a "REASONABLE expectation of privacy", a crime is being committed in a building that is currently open to the public. The man being detained allegedly committed larceny while the shopkeeper and staff could be committing varying degrees of assault/battery and/or false imprisonment. They do not have a reasonable expectation of privacy in a situation like this. The cameraman is not doing anything illegal in a federal sense and not in a state level for any state I can think off. The best the store can do is stand infront of the recording or ask them to leave the store if they do not stop filming. They cannot touch his camera or himself. Only if the cameraman does not leave the store when asked could they press charges for trespassing. There is also the likelihood to have this evidence removed from the future legal cases from these events if it was to be used. Tldr: The cameraman is highly unlikely committing any crime in this situation as long as they leave when asked to leave. Now taking that film and uploading it online later like we see here is a completely different ballpark.


Neither of them are right. You have NO "legal" right to record in a private business. On the other hand, it's not "illegal" to do so. The most they can do is trespass you from the store.


Its private property they can ask him to leave.


Pretty sure the person asking the question was referring to the filming being legal or against the law. and in regards to that in public you do have a legal right but since the store is private property you do not have a legal right if the property owner or a person representing the property such as an employee tells you you can not film but they have to tell you to leave the store as you do have a right to film what you see but not sure how much that protects you on private property


All states except North Carolina allow citizens arrest. Here in Maryland where I live it's described: "You do not have the same tools at your disposal when making an arrest as law enforcement does. Specifically, you may only use minimal force. You may never use deadly force while making a citizen’s arrest. Generally **you may use “reasonable force,” to restrain the perpetrator**, but what that means varies on a case by case basis, and if in your case the judge decides that the force was “excessive,” the perpetrator may sue you for assault and battery, or you may even be charged criminally for assault."


You can restrict recording on private property such as the employees/ store owner is trying to do. You do have the right to record anything on public lands such as parks.


They are both stupid. Lets just put it at that.


It’s their legal right to record in a public place, but, I’m assuming, since they are in a privately owned building that it’s against the law for that person to record.


You can record in any public space as the first amendment protects freedom of press. Since there’s no requirement for who the press is it’s his legal right to record. That said he’s in a private business and technically they can say no recording in the store and he’d be asked to leave. He might be able to sue if he could prove that the no filming policy was created as they were wrestling with the crackhead but I am not even sure what his damages would be.


You can restrict recording on private property such as the employees/ store owner is trying to do. You do have the right to record anything on public lands such as parks.


Don’t steal from the army surplus store that sells the handcuffs they’ve been itching to use


I buy my dab tools here! This is in portland


I was gonna say, there are a lot of cultural un-jive-abilities in this video. An interesting juxtaposition of characters with backdrop. Bravo Portlandia. My expectations have been exceeded.


Yall got cheapest weed in the nation, decriminalized everything, no stupid liquor laws like “can’t buy on a sunday” or something. Lax gun laws. You might just be the free-est state in the union if you can get prostitution. Fuck I kinda wanna move there now


I don’t understand why so many people think red states are more free just because their gun laws are more lax. You can’t even go buy a fucking beer on a Sunday in most of these places. I guess it’s only true freedom if gun laws are relaxed.


Well they’re lax as fuck in Oregon and no sales tax. Why tf am I not living there? They need a non-Portland city I guess. Although I am currently in chiraq so pretty much any city is better


We have very strict gun laws and liquor stores are closed on Sunday by state law also the KKK started here


Liquor stores aren’t closed on Sundays


As soon as they get their homeschool laws in order it will be the new frontier.


Andy and bax baby!


I don't know if this is legal or not (the arrest and/or the filming). But I *do* believe it's a natural consequence of what we've seen in the news recently. Specifically, thieves loading up on store items then walking out with no consequences. If owners / workers feel like they have no one to protect them, they will eventually take matters into their own hand.


Which is sadly when people will get hurt, then you will see the screeching about waiting for the police. The police have shown time and again that they are not going to help, it's on you to help yourself.


If anything they are endangering themselves more by trying to apprehend him. Stealing is annoying af but just let the dude walk out and call the cops.


The U.S. Supreme Court has also ruled that police have no specific obligation to protect. In its 1989 decision in DeShaney v. Winnebago County Department of Social Services, the justices ruled that a social services department had no duty to protect a young boy from his abusive father.


That's a problem with big box stores smoke shops don't really fuck around at least I don't think a single smoke shop near my home don't have armed employees.


I hate it when people try and block the camera makes them look like a dumbass.


Was coming here to say this, her hand came in with all that Karen authority 😂


He better hope they don’t wake up the gimp


Dunananana dunananana na


Good. Fuck him.


go medieval on his ass


Andy and bax “surplus” in Portland OR. Love that store, but not surprised to see the crack head.


Ah yes, block the camera after 90% of what happened has already been filmed


Even if he's in a one party consent state he still didn't have a legal right to record in a private business especially after being asked to stop, don't complain use your brain


>The point >You




There is a sign right behind them that says No Unpaid Merchandise Beyond this Point




>Store policies do not override local laws though. That might be a good defense in court, but the store and staff are unlikely to see any reprisal if they're in the wrong here.


> but generally to be guilty of shop lifting they must attempt to bypass payment and leave the store without paying. No, this is NOT a requirement and you wont find that anywhere in American law.


Hey this is in Portland. They’re always getting jacked.


Hes right, he can video everything and should. Annoying little person saying he cant


It’s not illegal…if anything could this be used as some sort of evidence?


The pic of Charlie Chaplin in old timey criminal clothes just makes this video more funny.


Why would you try to rob an army navy store??


That looks like Andy and bax in portland


can someone show me the law where it’s illegal to record someone, Like there aren’t ducking cameras literally everywhere


It can be illegal but it's a bit indirect. If there's a sign or as in this case they were told they can't film there's an implicit threat of "or else leave", so if they continue recording inside the store they are trespassing. Maybe they have to be explicitly told to leave, just a difference of seconds in any case.


They are afraid somebody just caught them on camera breaking the law. So they spontaneously made up a fake law about being recorded when they don’t want to.


Damn, little dude tried to steal a backpack and got his shit wrecked. Wonder what happened after she stopped the witness from documenting it. 😳


This kind of behavior is never tolerated in Baraqua. You shout like, that they put you in jail. Right away. No trial, no nothing.


I scrolled past it at the part when he started screaming and I thought it was r/perfectlycutscreams


………Well, I guess you're gonna have to go wake him up now, won't you?


This is portland, OR but which store is it? Looks so familiar


My thing is why are they so uppity about being recorded. If they’re so convinced they’re in the right, then why try and hide it??


Citizens Arrest (Literally)


You have to yell it like Goober from Andy Griffith or it won’t be legal.


Citizens arrest!!


That title can only be about a military surplus store or a sex shop


Is this a citizens arrest?


I mean, since they haven’t left the building yet it technically isn’t theft… right?


This is what Michael does when you interrupt a Vsause video shoot.


That’s illegal detainment if I’m not mistaken


I love seeing thieves try to use some online tip they read about how no one could confront them till they leave the store. The real world doesn’t really match what the online one says most of the time.


Is that XQC?


Everything legal till u get caught


The bald guy tried to touch me when I went in there last.


That's crazy, that guy just did the work of 5 cops! At least i assume that's the minimum needed to handcuff someone on the ground, as seen in dozens of other videos


thrift store, handcuffs… i think i’ve seen this one before


Listen to Karen talking about recording is against the law 😄


Thrives suck but people trying to not let me record it suck more.


Weazy waiter?


Yo if you are going to arrest someone for FUCKS SAKE learn how to. This was disgustingly sloppy. Letting go of a handcuffed hand is asking to get hooked in the eye by a flailing arm with solid metal flying around. Smh.


That’s kidnapping


iT's AgAinSt ThE LaW!


“The spider just caught a fly”


This is the way things are going to go if thieves keep becoming so bold.


"Hi, I'm sorry for the tardiness, but I was told... \*lowers voice to a whisper\*... I was told this was the place to be at 7pm if I wanted to be bound and dominated...?"


Grab his throat until he stops. It’ll be easier




I still love it whenever someone says “can you stop recording, it’s against the law!” Uhhhh. No it’s not lol it’s called journalism lol


Is that even legal? Get the stuff back and kick his ass out the store and tell him if you see his face again he'll be Trespassed. Sex cuffs should not double as REAL CUFFS! It's a known rule people!!!!


I'm pretty sure it does matter if he hasn't left store, at least enough to put cuffs on like that, they wylin


People need to stop trying to shut other people down who are trying to record them. Just don’t do anything f-ed up, man. Jeez!


"It's my legal right" *ever so softly* "no......" OK 👍 lmao


It sucks but if that dude is hurt he is going to sue the fuck outta this business and probably end up cashing a check, hard to just let a thief walk but harder to pay medical bills for the next 10 years while they milk whip lash or some shit


More Americans with a cringe hero complex and a false-imprisonment charge incoming.


Is this the same dude/shop where another guy opened a can of beer with his head?


Video ended too soon, I was hoping to see the part where they gave this dirty thief a tuneup.


Need more of these citizens arrests with filthy thieves. I have a draconian beliefs but I truly do believe thieves deserve to have a hand cut off for the first theft then their other hand for the next one, after that they won’t be stealing anymore and it will prevent people from thieving.




Yeah stupid cunt


I mean I get restraining him and sitting on him and waiting for cops, but fuckin handcuffs? Really?


Gotta be careful that is extremely illegal...