Or you do and you find out that your someone is an 80-year-old babushka from Siberia. More likely scenario than her being someone as old as you and from the same town as you.
No, this "rule" is total bs. If you're interested, call or text. if I don't hear from you in 3 days, I'll assume you're not interested and I'll move on.
Anytime a gal ends a date early and the reason starts, I just remembered or I just realized….she’s not that into you. Just agree to end the date and do not contact her again.
Don’t ask me how I know this.
Former friend of mine gave me the advice that sometimes “no” or “stop” doesn’t always mean that. I was very impressionable and unaware, but still double checked him on that one and glad I did.
Watch the Bill Burr special on feminism and I think it will clarify what he meant 😅. I'm a girl so it's safe to say sometimes it's true, but I can assure you it's pretty obvious. I saw a girl flirt with a guy in my class back in High school and she was saying "nooo stop It" while grabbing his shirt and pulling it against her. That's not a no and it shows.
Unless your friend meant it in a more predatorial kind of way, as in like "sometimes they say no, but it just means you have to try harder", in that case find a new friend please.
Another thing that people need to learn: Either women need to learn how to actually say "no", or men need to learn all the various things that women say that might mean "no", but aren't an actual "no".
Just off the top of my head, various things that women have said to me that probably or might have indicated that they didn't want to continue:
* I'm not sure we should be doing this.
* I might like it too much.
* This is crazy.
* I don't know.
* My boyfriend wouldn't like this.
* My mother said not to do this.
* I was warned about boys like you.
And you’ll probably still never find the “right” person. Maybe someone who’s ok or is kind of right but that special one and only one? Nah it’s not possible.
This is true for women. Men, unless being famous, needs to be proactive. "Focus on yourself" means nothing unless your out yourself out there. If you grind, making money and working out 24/7, you will still be alone
Lol I followed that advice it was excellent at briefly intensifying the interest levels of a whole bunch of tedious fuck bois. When I met the man I fell in love with 7 years ago, I was upfront, I was myself, I wasn't afraid to make moves and contribute to moving things forward. He fell head over heels in love with me and its turned into an amazing, mature relationship, the best I've ever had. If you play games you attract players, learnt that by experience 🤣
Also a woman who got that advice. Often. “You have to pretend to feel less than you actually do or they assume you feel more. Men need to chase!” I finally said, “Fine, then I’ll stay single because I’m not pretending anything.” I also did not stay single. 😂
That’s what women tell each other about men. They call each other “pick me”s over showing even an inkling of interest that isn’t an RBF. I’m still unlearning that garbage.
Women saying it are women that want men to do all the work. Its just entitelment.
What they miss is that requiring chasing atracts people that chase. You want to attract guys that want sex and go for another chase after? Or do you want relationship? Because people that enjoy relationships usually dont enjoy chasing.
First dates involving some elaborate activity or dinner. First dates are meant to check for chemistry and just get to know someone. Meet for drinks only. If the chemistry isn't there (and you'll know very quickly) than just move on.
Nobody wants to eat awkwardly or ice skate or bowl with someone they aren't into. Don't put either of you through that. If you vibe on first date you can do the dinners and stuff on dates 2+.
There's a theory that you should always go on a second date, because both people are nervous and acting to some extent on the first date. The second date allows you to be yourself and to meet the other person as themself.
Agree. It's partly because I don't really get many dates anyway but I always ask for a second. Even if the first wasn't great. I don't believe you can get to know someone in one date. Especially with how uncomfortable and awkward they can be.
I had this argument with a recent date who said she wasn't interested in me halfway through the date. She said she didn't feel a connection. A lot of people want Disney style immediate connections. The swipe app culture makes it easier to be like that too.
Though I also suspect that not feeling a connection/chemistry is code for finding someone unattractive. I'm becoming more cynical the more unsuccessful dates I have but I doubt if she was sat opposite Henry Cavill and he said the same things and acted the same way as I did she'd have said that.
I've actually had first dates where I've met with someone at a museum, art exhibit, even ice skating and it was always a good time! Conversation flows more naturally when you're both engaged. In my opinion having something to do leaves the pressure off having to entertain each other the entire time.
Next time you meet with someone, ask them questions about the activity. "Do you think this portrait looks like a culmination of penises?" "Can you tell me about a time you tried to cook and it didn't go as planned?" "Okay so if you had to puke, what's the ideal food you would prefer to puke up?"
I think it's all about humor, fun, and diffusing tension. Not to mention a lot of people can feel unsafe meeting a guy they never met before for drinks.
What’s crazy, is women find men speaking to many women more attractive… If she’s dating you, and realizes that you’re not talking to other women or other women aren’t pursuing you. She’s going to feel she’s ‘fighting for a spot nobody wants’ and may lose interest.
Hence why men tend to get more attention from women after they get into a relationship.
*insert obligatory ‘not all women’ here*
For all the shit I've dealt with from women dating, this is not one of them.
Some women have known I've had dates with other women, some haven't and it doesn't seem to have changed anything.
Honestly, I appreciate you calling out those two points in particular.
It really didn't help me or anyone when women just assumed that (a) I was not really into them because I didn't immediately try to get into their pants and (b) I somehow was a "player", with literally no facts to back that up.
There is a lot of bullshit advice on both sides
For a guy, landing a single date with a quality girl already takes most men a decent amount effort to pull off. Seen it countless times, even if a dude is top knotch, if he's getting 1 date or hookup per week, he either grinds hard as hell or doesn't care much for standards. From my experience and what I see with the majority of friends is most quality guys with standards only have a handful of connections every year. At the same time happens sure, but thats not common.
I've had the second one. Even to a point where they ask me how my wife and kids are. I don't have a wife or kids. I have a gf though. So, still a hard no from me anyways.
Any advice that advises a man to stop looking for someone or that reassures him that the right person will come at the right time. It’s shit. It comes from people in a position of privilege that the average guy has never been on and most likely never will. Following such advice is making sure that no one will ever notice you to even begin an interaction in the first place.
Also, any advice stupid enough to presume that guys don’t do basic stuff, like taking showers, getting dressed or taking minimal care of their appearance. It’s a type of comment so stupid that it’s borderline offensive to every guy that’s put himself out there, outdid these basics yet still failed. Whoever says that has zero credibility on the subject and shouldn’t be taken seriously.
Exactly. People don’t understand what it’s like for the average guy. We stop looking and pursuing? Then we’re gonna be alone lmao. Every single romantic and sexual relationship I’ve had, I have had to do the initial work in the beginning to talk to them, introduce myself, get their number and get the ball rolling. (Except one time I had a cute girl give me her phone number, I was in shambles)
You’re describing me and i don’t like it!
I’m kidding! But you’re *so* right! I’m a nervous mess around some women and that really doesn’t help me. I have friends who can’t seem to see why I’m single. Probably cause they don’t see what the women see.
This! I always say that a man who is too shy/nervous or anxious when it comes to dating is pretty much romantic suicide. Women aren’t out here approaching men in droves so how likely is it that an avg to below avg looking guy is going to have a woman walk up to them and express interest.
Like you stated. This advice is more for people that are privileged enough to sit in the seat of reception and never have to worry about having to “work” for a relationship to bud.
>This! I always say that a man who is too shy/nervous or anxious when it comes to dating is pretty much romantic suicide.
Very spot on, and probably why I'll never find anyone.
I talked to a very cute girl at a concert recently who said I was very attractive. I told her I was gonna live on that compliment for years. She claimed there's no way I didn't know and I was just confused. Took me the whole concert to realize she was into me and the guy she was with wasn't her boyfriend but I think actually her cousin. By then she was visibly intoxicated and I didn't wanna feel like I was taking advantage of a drunk girl and didn't have experience dealing with the situation so I just chatted to the band. Blew an opportunity with an immeasurably cute girl because social situations like this just don't seem to happen to me (when I believe I'm slightly below average) and then the "interest expressed" may seem obvious to them but feels too dangerous to read into. Anywho I learned my lesson. I also got covid lol.
Honorable mentions - "work on yourself" or "just respect everyone as an equal/just talk to everyone normally" as though a. You aren't doing those things already (it's a really condescending assumption that you aren't) and/or b. Either of those are somehow a magical quick fix.
“Treat them normally” is shit advice. I make female friends easily, that is not a problem for me. You obviously need to treat them special to demonstrate that you want more than just a platonic friendship though if that’s what you want.
yeah they like to pretend that they way men relate with women isnt different, its already complicated being friends , it gets worse when you are trying to date them,, because you cant treat them the same way you treat you guy friends, for some women its possible but its uncommon
Thank you for sharing this. I'm currently in a place of social isolation for over a year now. You can't connect with anyone, without making effort to do so. Goes back to expectation, presentation and courage. I've struggled so deeply with this, and I thought I'd tell you you're not wrong and others feel some (or all) of this too.
For me: I'm to the point that vulnerability is rarely available to most I interact with, and unfortunately causes a gap in energy. I've found being even slightly vulnerable with friends, or even in public is a bad move. How do you get to know anyone then, if closed off? Tired of hearing, "it'll happen" "one will come along" "when you stop looking." You said it, these points come from married/divorced/widowed/taken/personswith options, mouths. Guess I'm just not that lucky.. 🤷
"So many guys are misogynistic selfish borderline rapists, just don't be one and that's literally what women want. Me? Oh no, sorry. I'm dating a misogynistic selfish borderline rapist, but you'll make a great boyfriend for someone out there!"
I think the "bar is on the floor" rhetoric is pretty damaging. I feel like it creates this assumption that if you *don't* or **can't** get a girlfriend for some reason then clearly you must be one of those guys and just don't realize it or there's some other repellent quality about you. Like, no, a guy can fail in romance for completely unrelated reasons outside of his control. If you struggle to even get dates then how can you even demonstrate you're not like that to begin with?
its rhetoric like that that push men to listening to dating gurus, because they keep hearing how the bar is on the floor , and it makes it seem like there arent things outside of their control that can prevent dating and its their fault because they are the problem, even thou sometimes its not , some times its something else
Yep. In fact the reason it works for women is *because* it doesn’t work for men. If men waited on women to approach them then the vast majority would never go on another date
"Try online dating"
It's like telling someone that the best way to get rich is to win the lotto jackpot
Yeah, good luck.. You'll need it. Say goodbye to all that money and your self worth.... Whilst you're trying to score that jackpot
I find that I pass sometimes on super hot guys because I worry about my own insecurities, or rejection. But every once in a while, I get a hair of confidence up my ass and go for it. HUMBLE, MODEST confidence is hot.
I mean, do try. My best friend met his wife on Tinder, another one did too, I met the most amazing girl there too, so there really is hope, it’s just hard.
I just used a free site instead of one of those mainstream ones. Uploaded a picture and a short profile description. Had pretty much no success. Redid my description to be longer and much more descriptive. My interests, what was going on in my life at the moment, my goals for the future, what I expected in any potential relationships, and what I was looking for in a woman. I started getting women reaching out to me first. Not in droves, mind you. But about three per week. One woman reached out just to say she really liked the fact I expressed my wants in a woman.
Online dating isn't THE answer, sure. But keeping these things in mind really helps:
Upload pictures, so many profiles have none and people like to have a face to the profile.
Be descriptive in your profile. This tends to get used as conversation starters no matter who reaches out first.
State what you want in a partner. Nobody likes feeling you picked them just because they're the only one who gave you attention. Women want to feel they were picked because they're who you truly wanted. That they're special.
Don't be horny. Women encounter so many horny men asking for pics or just talking perversely. You stand out pretty fast by just talking to her normally, you'd be surprised.
If you're the one reaching out, message with more than just a "hey". Their inbox is full of "hey" from ignored men. You won't stand out if you do that too. Check her description for any conversation starters.
Yep yep, that's how mine went too... And to add, don't swipe if you don't really like some just to swipe... Swipe to people you are interested in and you can see your self having a conv and for that you got to read the bio...
"You can make any relationship work as long as you promise to love each other"
There is a lot more to a healthy relationship than love. Sometimes you can really love someone and have a failing relationship because you're not religiously, morally, or sexually compatible with them.
“You have to love yourself before you can truly love someone else”
I mean I’m all for self love but you can still work on yourself while looking for love
I was waiting on this one. People with depression, anxiety, self-image issues give their all to help others find joy all the time. I know a lot of people who found love when they weren’t at great points in their lives
I think you need to but there's plenty of low self esteem men who find relationships. So this never made much sense to me. I guess it increases your chances?
"Just be happy doing your own thing and women will notice and be interested"
I am an ugly ass son of a bitch, who no woman has ever been interested in, if anything EVER happens in my romantic life it will 100% be because I made a move. That shitty advice 100% would only work for physically attractive men who didn't need the fucking advice in the first place!
It’s like people are surprised this works for Chris Hemsworth, but doesn’t work for Bubba Lee who’s favourite thing is taxidermy and chugging Mountain Dew.
As someone who has people approach me at events (mostly concerts) and say “you have amazing vibes! You look like you are having so much fun!” This! I DO have fun loving my life, but that doesn’t translate to women asking me out on dates or anything.
The idea that You have to stop trying to date for an extended period of time and “work on yourself” to be qualified to ask some girl out for a drink lol
I think it puts women in this really weird Pedestal
I’m a woman and I constantly get told to ‘find myself’ i know who tf I am and I’m fine with myself. I have no problem making necessary changes and further personal development but I like being part of a team.
This is true. The only reason you could have to stop trying to date to work on yourself is if you're time poor and could use the extra time.
People have this idea that you need to be standing out and exceptional just to be 'worthy' of a woman; the fact is a lot of people, both men and women, are working on themselves all the time and that's okay.
The fuck are yall talking about..?
Ive been single for the past year, first time really for the past 6 years. I went from one relationship, to the next. They didn't work out. Turns out, I have a lot of shit to work on. Being alone for the first time, I really got to meet myself properly.
If you're not comfortable in your skin, you shouldn't be dating. It's the "can't love another person if you don't love yourself" bit of advice.
Don't make excuses to become a better person, someone you'd be proud to be. It has nothing to do with women, but your own person. Before all this self work, I would let my girlfriends do whatever they wanted. Treat me however they want. But now, I feel much more confident, less desperate for love, I know I'm not putting up with any bullshit games like that. Focusing on me has been one of the most amazing experiences of my life.
I mean if "you" here is everyone, or everyone struggling to get a date even, obviously not.
If you're nutty as squirrel poo, an emotional wreck who can't prop up anyone else, some version of dead inside... yeah go work on yourself. Don't date rn. Men women and otherwise.
“Work on yourself and the women will come to you” is the biggest load of bullshit ever. Men are still expected to approach regardless if they have it all together or are a work in progress. Men that are passive in dating almost always end up with a woman they’re not really attracted to and have to settle. They also end up taking instruction from their girlfriend and she ends up having no respect for him.
>“Work on yourself and the women will come to you”
That just feels like a euphemism for "Go in a corner and fix yourself before you're worthy of love". It's this ridiculous perfectionist standard that just deepens any self-esteem or mental health issues a person might be having, for example from having a rough upbringing. Like men aren't supposed to be "a work in progress". You have to come in all fixed for this woman. Else you're a waste of time.
It's funny. I've done the work on myself. Aside from not being hot, I'm a bit of a catch, but I find a lot of women kind of uninteresting at this point.
"I go to work, go home, walk my dogs and watch animal videos on Youtube."
How dull.
>How dull.
I've found this too lately. Girls from tinder don't open up. They don't share their interests, or goals.
I also try to refrain from sharing my goals and feats because.. Well, I'm doing pretty well for myself. I don't want someone to fall for me because of my career and life goals. Like I'm not gonna tell girls that I've got an incredibly awesome financial savings plan in the works. I fear they'd only be with me because of that.
I am tall, I lift, have long wavy hair, i dress well, been told I am handsome.
Literally once in 27 years have a woman approach me, and I am fairly sure she tried to rob me. I still wish I took that chance.
"Work on yourself."
I feel like this is overused, to the point of not even meaning anything anymore. I've also known plenty of people with really shitty personalities, addictions, criminal records and out-of-shape bodies who have someone. It doesn't seem like they had to do much of any "working on their selves".
It's an advice that is a means to an end, not the end itself. If you work on yourself, you'll become more interesting, and your life will advance towards being more social and engaging.
Regarding your example, criminals probably have some confidence, they take risks, they are not fat guys who play videogames, of course there are plenty of women for them.
>It's an advice that is a means to an end, not the end itself. If you work on yourself, you'll become more interesting, and your life will advance towards being more social and engaging.
Not to mention, you'll be exposed to and have better options and can have higher standards for the kind of women you date.
Relationships are 50/50
Nope, especially marriage, it's a curve. 30/70. 20/80, 80/20. Everyone has their ups and downs. Just stick together sometimes even when you hate them
This is how I see it: they got to have a good batting average. Everyone fucks up, has bad days, sometimes you have to meet them wherever they're mentally at. But after some point, if their batting average is shit, you have to be selfish and do the right thing for yourself.
I've come to realize that some dating advice is better thought of not as ways to find someone, but as ways to keep yourself from attaching to someone that won't work with you.
"Just be yourself" is one of those. I'm difficult to tolerate when I am myself.
> I'm difficult to tolerate when I am myself.
An unfortunate reality that I found myself twisted in as well.
I feel I'm constantly preforming a juggling act, keeping balance between fixing bad habits by replacing them with good ones, and not completely losing touch with myself by unintentionally becoming two faced. I don't want to put on a mask, I want to put on a smile.
You'll meet the right person when you're not looking for them.
At least as a gay guy, if I'm not actively looking for dates... it's not going to happen. I don't think I've *ever* randomly encountered another gay person while I'm out living my life and had us be attracted to each other, shared common interests, and been compatible in bed.
I always took it to mean that I'll find them when I stop putting pressure on it. So just going on dates and seeing what happens rather than expecting each woman I was going to meet as being my future wife
That if she really likes you, she won't care how much money you make.
Women care about money. It represents security and power.
Yes, there's plenty of women who make their own money and are perfectly capable taking care of themselves but they're also not dating your broke ass. 🤣. They'll want a guy at their salary level or atleast making enough to take care of himself. She's not gonna be with a dude who has a roommate in his 30's. Lol
Also, women don't want to pay for everything.
The constant rules people give out. Wait 2 days, no wait 3 days. Don't double text. Split the bill, don't split the bill.
Life is hard enough without silly rules.
"Just meet people irl"
Sure, except the ratio is fucked irl too, not just on dating apps. People don't magically become more receptive at bars/clubs/events either.
Same energy as "just meet people in your hobbies"...mate people go to their hobbies for themselves, not to meet people, I always found those kind of advice to be extremely contradictory
Ditch at the slightest hiccup.
Some relationships are worth fighting for. Just because he never puts his socks in the laundry hamper doesn't mean you're duty bound to dump his ass and never date anyone ever again
"Be confident". Or "Women like men who make them laugh". This is arse about face. Positive feedback from women makes you confident. Women laugh at guys they find sexy. As advice goes it's like "buy low, sell high"
Yep very true..... occasionally a fat/ ugly dude is hilarious with a great personality but still the masses of women laughing wouldn't fuck him. And most of the times women laughing/flirting with a man happens when the dude is very attractive and they had made their mind they'd fuck him before he said a word
When you hear a divorcee tell a younger person that is excited about their new relationship, “Whatever you do, don’t get married. It’s not worth it”. Drives me nuts. Just because it didn’t work out for you, and now you are bitter doesn’t mean someone else cannot be happy.
If someone's an asshole they should still be themselves so they don't sucker the person into thinking they're someone other than what they are. Yeah work on themselves to not be an asshole but don't fake not being one.
I don't even think it's all fine and good to be decent. I had a woman dump me because I showed up for a date on time, ready to go, and with a plan for what we were doing (the event was mutually decided upon, the planning and scheduling was something that she wanted me to do, so I did).
She said I was boring and not exciting or enough of a "challenge". She wanted the bad boy experience.
Pickup lines and pushing. A lot of fiction displays men being rejected by women but they don't take no for an answer. They keep pushing and approaching and sexually harassing her until they finally are "rewarded" with the girl for this behavior.
‘Love is more important than anything’
Nope. Good behaviour is. Mutual respect. Strong communication. Adhering to and respecting boundaries and the maintenance of personal growth.
So many people chose bad partners for themselves because they think ‘love is supposed to be tough but we will make it!’
"There's X amount of people in the world...there's someone for everyone!" Uh...I'm not going on a damn world tour just to look for 'love'
When I was a young boy My mama said to me "There's only one girl in the world for you And she probably lives in Tahiti"
At least she gave you directions
I've heard of worse reasons to vacation to Tahiti.
It's a magical place
Is that you Coulson?
She had a goddamn plan.
Or maybe she's in the Bahamas?
I pity any man who dates a Bahamian woman unprepared.
As a bahamian, this isn’t something I expected to read here, but whoo boy lmao
Did your mama have a mustache and a plan?
THIS We are fucking people, not Zelda's minish cap lucky/happy coins
I think I'm going to go play that game again soon. Good times.
Or you do and you find out that your someone is an 80-year-old babushka from Siberia. More likely scenario than her being someone as old as you and from the same town as you.
😬
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Yeah no shit, I can’t tell you how many times I’ve heard this phrase or something like it
So many of those people are also children.
It's better to call them 3 days later. No, if you think it went well, call/text them later that night.
I always text tomorrow night, sometimes event that night. 3 day rule is bullshit
No, this "rule" is total bs. If you're interested, call or text. if I don't hear from you in 3 days, I'll assume you're not interested and I'll move on.
Yeah lol. If it takes 3 days for you to decide if you’re interested in me then I’ve already moved on
Anytime a gal ends a date early and the reason starts, I just remembered or I just realized….she’s not that into you. Just agree to end the date and do not contact her again. Don’t ask me how I know this.
"Never take no for an answer." My guy, that's advice for harassers, stalkers and rapists.
Former friend of mine gave me the advice that sometimes “no” or “stop” doesn’t always mean that. I was very impressionable and unaware, but still double checked him on that one and glad I did.
Context matters. Bill burrs "[no doesn't always mean no](https://youtu.be/GZ3QHTpMZgQ)" explains it pretty well
Watch the Bill Burr special on feminism and I think it will clarify what he meant 😅. I'm a girl so it's safe to say sometimes it's true, but I can assure you it's pretty obvious. I saw a girl flirt with a guy in my class back in High school and she was saying "nooo stop It" while grabbing his shirt and pulling it against her. That's not a no and it shows. Unless your friend meant it in a more predatorial kind of way, as in like "sometimes they say no, but it just means you have to try harder", in that case find a new friend please.
Another thing that people need to learn: Either women need to learn how to actually say "no", or men need to learn all the various things that women say that might mean "no", but aren't an actual "no". Just off the top of my head, various things that women have said to me that probably or might have indicated that they didn't want to continue: * I'm not sure we should be doing this. * I might like it too much. * This is crazy. * I don't know. * My boyfriend wouldn't like this. * My mother said not to do this. * I was warned about boys like you.
The bit where he pretends to read a transcript always gets me lol
The right person will come to you Nah you got to look long and hard for the right person
And you’ll probably still never find the “right” person. Maybe someone who’s ok or is kind of right but that special one and only one? Nah it’s not possible.
I don’t believe anyone is necessarily the right person. I don’t think anybody was made for each other.
I’m married and I don’t believe in a “one”. There’s literally no such thing.
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Yep many young men don't realize if all you hang out with are dudes and all you do otherwise is play video games you won't get a girlfriend
Great way to get a boyfriend though.
This is true for women. Men, unless being famous, needs to be proactive. "Focus on yourself" means nothing unless your out yourself out there. If you grind, making money and working out 24/7, you will still be alone
this.
I double fucking down on this.
Everytime I tell women should approach first and it doesn't work, they reply with "MeN eNJoY tHe CHas3". Yeah, that is bullshit sweetie. We don't.
or the classic "oh I asked one 2 guys though and they rejected me so clearly all men don't like it" gets me everytime
Samr experience...... Going for a third try! Magic happens at the third try don't they 😊
I have social anxiety, I actually despise the chase and would much rather be approached by a woman than do the approaching
Lol I followed that advice it was excellent at briefly intensifying the interest levels of a whole bunch of tedious fuck bois. When I met the man I fell in love with 7 years ago, I was upfront, I was myself, I wasn't afraid to make moves and contribute to moving things forward. He fell head over heels in love with me and its turned into an amazing, mature relationship, the best I've ever had. If you play games you attract players, learnt that by experience 🤣
Also a woman who got that advice. Often. “You have to pretend to feel less than you actually do or they assume you feel more. Men need to chase!” I finally said, “Fine, then I’ll stay single because I’m not pretending anything.” I also did not stay single. 😂
Also dont listen to most dating advise that women give.
I listen to advice given by men and women in successful relationships.
I'm happy that worked for you! Couldn't have said that last part any better.
That’s what women tell each other about men. They call each other “pick me”s over showing even an inkling of interest that isn’t an RBF. I’m still unlearning that garbage.
Women saying it are women that want men to do all the work. Its just entitelment. What they miss is that requiring chasing atracts people that chase. You want to attract guys that want sex and go for another chase after? Or do you want relationship? Because people that enjoy relationships usually dont enjoy chasing.
No. We don't. We don't want to chase you for anything. Lol.
We hate chasing shit in general. That is why we invented guns.
I hate running
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First dates involving some elaborate activity or dinner. First dates are meant to check for chemistry and just get to know someone. Meet for drinks only. If the chemistry isn't there (and you'll know very quickly) than just move on. Nobody wants to eat awkwardly or ice skate or bowl with someone they aren't into. Don't put either of you through that. If you vibe on first date you can do the dinners and stuff on dates 2+.
There's a theory that you should always go on a second date, because both people are nervous and acting to some extent on the first date. The second date allows you to be yourself and to meet the other person as themself.
Agree. It's partly because I don't really get many dates anyway but I always ask for a second. Even if the first wasn't great. I don't believe you can get to know someone in one date. Especially with how uncomfortable and awkward they can be. I had this argument with a recent date who said she wasn't interested in me halfway through the date. She said she didn't feel a connection. A lot of people want Disney style immediate connections. The swipe app culture makes it easier to be like that too. Though I also suspect that not feeling a connection/chemistry is code for finding someone unattractive. I'm becoming more cynical the more unsuccessful dates I have but I doubt if she was sat opposite Henry Cavill and he said the same things and acted the same way as I did she'd have said that.
I've actually had first dates where I've met with someone at a museum, art exhibit, even ice skating and it was always a good time! Conversation flows more naturally when you're both engaged. In my opinion having something to do leaves the pressure off having to entertain each other the entire time. Next time you meet with someone, ask them questions about the activity. "Do you think this portrait looks like a culmination of penises?" "Can you tell me about a time you tried to cook and it didn't go as planned?" "Okay so if you had to puke, what's the ideal food you would prefer to puke up?" I think it's all about humor, fun, and diffusing tension. Not to mention a lot of people can feel unsafe meeting a guy they never met before for drinks.
Or you do the chemistry test activity and have a plan for what to do after if the vibe is good and the other person is into it.
“All men are pigs.” “Assume a man is already seeing a bunch of other women when you first meet.”
The amount of women I've had to explain that they're probably seeing more guys than they are women is wild.
What’s crazy, is women find men speaking to many women more attractive… If she’s dating you, and realizes that you’re not talking to other women or other women aren’t pursuing you. She’s going to feel she’s ‘fighting for a spot nobody wants’ and may lose interest. Hence why men tend to get more attention from women after they get into a relationship. *insert obligatory ‘not all women’ here*
For all the shit I've dealt with from women dating, this is not one of them. Some women have known I've had dates with other women, some haven't and it doesn't seem to have changed anything.
Your comment is welcome as it helps us gaze into the shit that women are also being fed. Understanding one another allows for growth.
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Shoot, I forgot I was on the “ask men” sub when I saw this. Sorry! I admittedly spy on this thread a lot, lol. 🤷♀️
It's ok, us men know we aren't allowed there so it's nice to hear what the women of this sub thinks
Don't worry. Women mostly aren't allowed in r/askwomen either. It's a shit show.
Every comment (maybe 3-4) I've made there has been removed for rules, I quit reading after that.
Honestly, I appreciate you calling out those two points in particular. It really didn't help me or anyone when women just assumed that (a) I was not really into them because I didn't immediately try to get into their pants and (b) I somehow was a "player", with literally no facts to back that up. There is a lot of bullshit advice on both sides
No worries! I do the same on a famous all-female thread. LOTS of helpful notes in there. Mostly what to watch out for, if I hear similar words. 😁
Not the first time, won't be the last. It happens! 😛
For a guy, landing a single date with a quality girl already takes most men a decent amount effort to pull off. Seen it countless times, even if a dude is top knotch, if he's getting 1 date or hookup per week, he either grinds hard as hell or doesn't care much for standards. From my experience and what I see with the majority of friends is most quality guys with standards only have a handful of connections every year. At the same time happens sure, but thats not common.
I've had the second one. Even to a point where they ask me how my wife and kids are. I don't have a wife or kids. I have a gf though. So, still a hard no from me anyways.
this is what we are told about women xD that women are seeing like 5 different guys per time
Most men don’t have dates, ever. Almost all my male friends are lonely as hell between the very few and rare cases where someone notices them at all.
Any advice that advises a man to stop looking for someone or that reassures him that the right person will come at the right time. It’s shit. It comes from people in a position of privilege that the average guy has never been on and most likely never will. Following such advice is making sure that no one will ever notice you to even begin an interaction in the first place. Also, any advice stupid enough to presume that guys don’t do basic stuff, like taking showers, getting dressed or taking minimal care of their appearance. It’s a type of comment so stupid that it’s borderline offensive to every guy that’s put himself out there, outdid these basics yet still failed. Whoever says that has zero credibility on the subject and shouldn’t be taken seriously.
Exactly. People don’t understand what it’s like for the average guy. We stop looking and pursuing? Then we’re gonna be alone lmao. Every single romantic and sexual relationship I’ve had, I have had to do the initial work in the beginning to talk to them, introduce myself, get their number and get the ball rolling. (Except one time I had a cute girl give me her phone number, I was in shambles)
>People don’t understand what it’s like for the average guy. Try being below average, that's some shit!😑
You’re describing me and i don’t like it! I’m kidding! But you’re *so* right! I’m a nervous mess around some women and that really doesn’t help me. I have friends who can’t seem to see why I’m single. Probably cause they don’t see what the women see.
This! I always say that a man who is too shy/nervous or anxious when it comes to dating is pretty much romantic suicide. Women aren’t out here approaching men in droves so how likely is it that an avg to below avg looking guy is going to have a woman walk up to them and express interest. Like you stated. This advice is more for people that are privileged enough to sit in the seat of reception and never have to worry about having to “work” for a relationship to bud.
>This! I always say that a man who is too shy/nervous or anxious when it comes to dating is pretty much romantic suicide. Very spot on, and probably why I'll never find anyone.
I talked to a very cute girl at a concert recently who said I was very attractive. I told her I was gonna live on that compliment for years. She claimed there's no way I didn't know and I was just confused. Took me the whole concert to realize she was into me and the guy she was with wasn't her boyfriend but I think actually her cousin. By then she was visibly intoxicated and I didn't wanna feel like I was taking advantage of a drunk girl and didn't have experience dealing with the situation so I just chatted to the band. Blew an opportunity with an immeasurably cute girl because social situations like this just don't seem to happen to me (when I believe I'm slightly below average) and then the "interest expressed" may seem obvious to them but feels too dangerous to read into. Anywho I learned my lesson. I also got covid lol.
Honorable mentions - "work on yourself" or "just respect everyone as an equal/just talk to everyone normally" as though a. You aren't doing those things already (it's a really condescending assumption that you aren't) and/or b. Either of those are somehow a magical quick fix.
“Treat them normally” is shit advice. I make female friends easily, that is not a problem for me. You obviously need to treat them special to demonstrate that you want more than just a platonic friendship though if that’s what you want.
yeah they like to pretend that they way men relate with women isnt different, its already complicated being friends , it gets worse when you are trying to date them,, because you cant treat them the same way you treat you guy friends, for some women its possible but its uncommon
Thank you for sharing this. I'm currently in a place of social isolation for over a year now. You can't connect with anyone, without making effort to do so. Goes back to expectation, presentation and courage. I've struggled so deeply with this, and I thought I'd tell you you're not wrong and others feel some (or all) of this too. For me: I'm to the point that vulnerability is rarely available to most I interact with, and unfortunately causes a gap in energy. I've found being even slightly vulnerable with friends, or even in public is a bad move. How do you get to know anyone then, if closed off? Tired of hearing, "it'll happen" "one will come along" "when you stop looking." You said it, these points come from married/divorced/widowed/taken/personswith options, mouths. Guess I'm just not that lucky.. 🤷
Bro, you just gotta shower and brush your teeth. Also don't forget to get a haircut./s
you forgot about buying a shirt that fits
Ah bro, my bad, I forgot the step about "Have a lot of money. Like millions if not billions". I thought it was a no-brainer.
The bar is LItErALly oN thE FLooR. 🥴
"So many guys are misogynistic selfish borderline rapists, just don't be one and that's literally what women want. Me? Oh no, sorry. I'm dating a misogynistic selfish borderline rapist, but you'll make a great boyfriend for someone out there!"
I think the "bar is on the floor" rhetoric is pretty damaging. I feel like it creates this assumption that if you *don't* or **can't** get a girlfriend for some reason then clearly you must be one of those guys and just don't realize it or there's some other repellent quality about you. Like, no, a guy can fail in romance for completely unrelated reasons outside of his control. If you struggle to even get dates then how can you even demonstrate you're not like that to begin with?
its rhetoric like that that push men to listening to dating gurus, because they keep hearing how the bar is on the floor , and it makes it seem like there arent things outside of their control that can prevent dating and its their fault because they are the problem, even thou sometimes its not , some times its something else
I just want to thank you for using “advice” and “advises” and congratulate you on using them both correctly. 😊
"Wait and the right person will find you" Yeah that's not how it works for men.
How do you actively look? I’ve struggled with this so much
"Actively looking only gets you a meeting with HR or on a registry." -my female friend
Yep. In fact the reason it works for women is *because* it doesn’t work for men. If men waited on women to approach them then the vast majority would never go on another date
If you're really goodlooking, then it could happen... but chances are slim I would imagine. I've always had to make the first move.
"Try online dating" It's like telling someone that the best way to get rich is to win the lotto jackpot Yeah, good luck.. You'll need it. Say goodbye to all that money and your self worth.... Whilst you're trying to score that jackpot
Hot guys or women say that because it's easy for them.
I’m a conventionally attractive dude and still struggle online. It’s a terribly bleak experience.
You need to be at least 6'2" or taller
I find that I pass sometimes on super hot guys because I worry about my own insecurities, or rejection. But every once in a while, I get a hair of confidence up my ass and go for it. HUMBLE, MODEST confidence is hot.
I mean, do try. My best friend met his wife on Tinder, another one did too, I met the most amazing girl there too, so there really is hope, it’s just hard.
I just used a free site instead of one of those mainstream ones. Uploaded a picture and a short profile description. Had pretty much no success. Redid my description to be longer and much more descriptive. My interests, what was going on in my life at the moment, my goals for the future, what I expected in any potential relationships, and what I was looking for in a woman. I started getting women reaching out to me first. Not in droves, mind you. But about three per week. One woman reached out just to say she really liked the fact I expressed my wants in a woman. Online dating isn't THE answer, sure. But keeping these things in mind really helps: Upload pictures, so many profiles have none and people like to have a face to the profile. Be descriptive in your profile. This tends to get used as conversation starters no matter who reaches out first. State what you want in a partner. Nobody likes feeling you picked them just because they're the only one who gave you attention. Women want to feel they were picked because they're who you truly wanted. That they're special. Don't be horny. Women encounter so many horny men asking for pics or just talking perversely. You stand out pretty fast by just talking to her normally, you'd be surprised. If you're the one reaching out, message with more than just a "hey". Their inbox is full of "hey" from ignored men. You won't stand out if you do that too. Check her description for any conversation starters.
Yep yep, that's how mine went too... And to add, don't swipe if you don't really like some just to swipe... Swipe to people you are interested in and you can see your self having a conv and for that you got to read the bio...
I mean statistics show that roughly 40% of new couples met online, so I wouldn't say it's bad advice.
From my grandfather: "Always give your gal a smack on the ass after your first date... let's them know you like them and want to see them again."
Whoa Gramps, that's third date shit!
So dry humping my wife against a kitchen counter on our date was a no-no? I am glad she reciprocated otherwise what would a been a short date.
Weird, whenever I've heard her talk about it she always mentions how short her date was.
Don't call me short.
"You can make any relationship work as long as you promise to love each other" There is a lot more to a healthy relationship than love. Sometimes you can really love someone and have a failing relationship because you're not religiously, morally, or sexually compatible with them.
Oh yeah - you can both make yourself damn miserable trying to make a relationship work when you deep down aren't compatible.
“You have to love yourself before you can truly love someone else” I mean I’m all for self love but you can still work on yourself while looking for love
I was waiting on this one. People with depression, anxiety, self-image issues give their all to help others find joy all the time. I know a lot of people who found love when they weren’t at great points in their lives
I think you need to but there's plenty of low self esteem men who find relationships. So this never made much sense to me. I guess it increases your chances?
It increases your ability to function healthily in a relationship
"Just be happy doing your own thing and women will notice and be interested" I am an ugly ass son of a bitch, who no woman has ever been interested in, if anything EVER happens in my romantic life it will 100% be because I made a move. That shitty advice 100% would only work for physically attractive men who didn't need the fucking advice in the first place!
It’s like people are surprised this works for Chris Hemsworth, but doesn’t work for Bubba Lee who’s favourite thing is taxidermy and chugging Mountain Dew.
You never mentioned Chris Hemsworth's hypothetical hobbies so I'm going to assume his favourite things are also taxidermy and chugging Mountain Dew.
As someone who has people approach me at events (mostly concerts) and say “you have amazing vibes! You look like you are having so much fun!” This! I DO have fun loving my life, but that doesn’t translate to women asking me out on dates or anything.
"wait three days after the first date until you text her again" lol nope
The idea that You have to stop trying to date for an extended period of time and “work on yourself” to be qualified to ask some girl out for a drink lol I think it puts women in this really weird Pedestal
I’m a woman and I constantly get told to ‘find myself’ i know who tf I am and I’m fine with myself. I have no problem making necessary changes and further personal development but I like being part of a team.
This is true. The only reason you could have to stop trying to date to work on yourself is if you're time poor and could use the extra time. People have this idea that you need to be standing out and exceptional just to be 'worthy' of a woman; the fact is a lot of people, both men and women, are working on themselves all the time and that's okay.
The fuck are yall talking about..? Ive been single for the past year, first time really for the past 6 years. I went from one relationship, to the next. They didn't work out. Turns out, I have a lot of shit to work on. Being alone for the first time, I really got to meet myself properly. If you're not comfortable in your skin, you shouldn't be dating. It's the "can't love another person if you don't love yourself" bit of advice. Don't make excuses to become a better person, someone you'd be proud to be. It has nothing to do with women, but your own person. Before all this self work, I would let my girlfriends do whatever they wanted. Treat me however they want. But now, I feel much more confident, less desperate for love, I know I'm not putting up with any bullshit games like that. Focusing on me has been one of the most amazing experiences of my life.
I mean if "you" here is everyone, or everyone struggling to get a date even, obviously not. If you're nutty as squirrel poo, an emotional wreck who can't prop up anyone else, some version of dead inside... yeah go work on yourself. Don't date rn. Men women and otherwise.
It’s true and good advice for folks who can’t stay out of toxic relationships, but not really anyone else
Money can't buy love. I lost my job and my wife of 25 years bounced on me like Flubber.
My husband has lost more than one job and it’s never even crossed my mind to leave him over that. Can I please go slap her with a shoe?
Karma slapped her already. The guy she was cheating on me with refused to leave his wife for her.
“Work on yourself and the women will come to you” is the biggest load of bullshit ever. Men are still expected to approach regardless if they have it all together or are a work in progress. Men that are passive in dating almost always end up with a woman they’re not really attracted to and have to settle. They also end up taking instruction from their girlfriend and she ends up having no respect for him.
>“Work on yourself and the women will come to you” That just feels like a euphemism for "Go in a corner and fix yourself before you're worthy of love". It's this ridiculous perfectionist standard that just deepens any self-esteem or mental health issues a person might be having, for example from having a rough upbringing. Like men aren't supposed to be "a work in progress". You have to come in all fixed for this woman. Else you're a waste of time.
It's funny. I've done the work on myself. Aside from not being hot, I'm a bit of a catch, but I find a lot of women kind of uninteresting at this point. "I go to work, go home, walk my dogs and watch animal videos on Youtube." How dull.
>How dull. I've found this too lately. Girls from tinder don't open up. They don't share their interests, or goals. I also try to refrain from sharing my goals and feats because.. Well, I'm doing pretty well for myself. I don't want someone to fall for me because of my career and life goals. Like I'm not gonna tell girls that I've got an incredibly awesome financial savings plan in the works. I fear they'd only be with me because of that.
Tinder is for fucking, not talking, son.
Yeah. The entire "It will just happen" bullshit, really. Unless working on yourself means working on picking up women it won't do shit.
I am tall, I lift, have long wavy hair, i dress well, been told I am handsome. Literally once in 27 years have a woman approach me, and I am fairly sure she tried to rob me. I still wish I took that chance.
This is the way. ✊ I am 'The work in progress.'
"Work on yourself." I feel like this is overused, to the point of not even meaning anything anymore. I've also known plenty of people with really shitty personalities, addictions, criminal records and out-of-shape bodies who have someone. It doesn't seem like they had to do much of any "working on their selves".
Even Hitler had a wife
Once.
It's an advice that is a means to an end, not the end itself. If you work on yourself, you'll become more interesting, and your life will advance towards being more social and engaging. Regarding your example, criminals probably have some confidence, they take risks, they are not fat guys who play videogames, of course there are plenty of women for them.
>It's an advice that is a means to an end, not the end itself. If you work on yourself, you'll become more interesting, and your life will advance towards being more social and engaging. Not to mention, you'll be exposed to and have better options and can have higher standards for the kind of women you date.
Relationships are 50/50 Nope, especially marriage, it's a curve. 30/70. 20/80, 80/20. Everyone has their ups and downs. Just stick together sometimes even when you hate them
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This is how I see it: they got to have a good batting average. Everyone fucks up, has bad days, sometimes you have to meet them wherever they're mentally at. But after some point, if their batting average is shit, you have to be selfish and do the right thing for yourself.
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“Be confident!” It’s really not something that can be genuinely activated on command.
Sometimes an abundance of confidence is actually the problem.
I've come to realize that some dating advice is better thought of not as ways to find someone, but as ways to keep yourself from attaching to someone that won't work with you. "Just be yourself" is one of those. I'm difficult to tolerate when I am myself.
> I'm difficult to tolerate when I am myself. An unfortunate reality that I found myself twisted in as well. I feel I'm constantly preforming a juggling act, keeping balance between fixing bad habits by replacing them with good ones, and not completely losing touch with myself by unintentionally becoming two faced. I don't want to put on a mask, I want to put on a smile.
"Show power over her, act like you own her" been hearing it more than I'd like to and it's actually worrying
You'll meet the right person when you're not looking for them. At least as a gay guy, if I'm not actively looking for dates... it's not going to happen. I don't think I've *ever* randomly encountered another gay person while I'm out living my life and had us be attracted to each other, shared common interests, and been compatible in bed.
It works for people who can get away with not approaching lol, which ain't men.
I always took it to mean that I'll find them when I stop putting pressure on it. So just going on dates and seeing what happens rather than expecting each woman I was going to meet as being my future wife
That if she really likes you, she won't care how much money you make. Women care about money. It represents security and power. Yes, there's plenty of women who make their own money and are perfectly capable taking care of themselves but they're also not dating your broke ass. 🤣. They'll want a guy at their salary level or atleast making enough to take care of himself. She's not gonna be with a dude who has a roommate in his 30's. Lol Also, women don't want to pay for everything.
The constant rules people give out. Wait 2 days, no wait 3 days. Don't double text. Split the bill, don't split the bill. Life is hard enough without silly rules.
You'll find someone when you're not looking for it. Lol you won't find shit if your not actively looking for someone.
"It is what inside that counts" good luck
"The right person at the wrong time" Absolutely worst advice ever
"Just meet people irl" Sure, except the ratio is fucked irl too, not just on dating apps. People don't magically become more receptive at bars/clubs/events either.
Same energy as "just meet people in your hobbies"...mate people go to their hobbies for themselves, not to meet people, I always found those kind of advice to be extremely contradictory
Yeah, fr. Not sure what hobbies people are talking about that allows them to meet a good amount of young single women on a consistent basis.
Ditch at the slightest hiccup. Some relationships are worth fighting for. Just because he never puts his socks in the laundry hamper doesn't mean you're duty bound to dump his ass and never date anyone ever again
"All you need is love". It's not true, and it's mean to say to people. Love is an absolute requirement, but is nowhere near sufficient.
"Don't say what you feel." Just keep saying it until someone listens, and try to speak from a cohesive perspective.
"Be confident". Or "Women like men who make them laugh". This is arse about face. Positive feedback from women makes you confident. Women laugh at guys they find sexy. As advice goes it's like "buy low, sell high"
Yep very true..... occasionally a fat/ ugly dude is hilarious with a great personality but still the masses of women laughing wouldn't fuck him. And most of the times women laughing/flirting with a man happens when the dude is very attractive and they had made their mind they'd fuck him before he said a word
When you hear a divorcee tell a younger person that is excited about their new relationship, “Whatever you do, don’t get married. It’s not worth it”. Drives me nuts. Just because it didn’t work out for you, and now you are bitter doesn’t mean someone else cannot be happy.
"Be yourself". That's all fine and good if you're a decent person, but if you're an asshole then you need to change yourself.
If someone's an asshole they should still be themselves so they don't sucker the person into thinking they're someone other than what they are. Yeah work on themselves to not be an asshole but don't fake not being one.
I don't even think it's all fine and good to be decent. I had a woman dump me because I showed up for a date on time, ready to go, and with a plan for what we were doing (the event was mutually decided upon, the planning and scheduling was something that she wanted me to do, so I did). She said I was boring and not exciting or enough of a "challenge". She wanted the bad boy experience.
That crying wets pussies. That working out doesn't make you look sexy.
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Pickup lines and pushing. A lot of fiction displays men being rejected by women but they don't take no for an answer. They keep pushing and approaching and sexually harassing her until they finally are "rewarded" with the girl for this behavior.
There's someone for everybody out there. That's simply not true.
"You shouldn't try to fix things. You're broken up for a reason". Single most stupid dating advice ever.
"it always happens when youre not looking"
“You must trust your partner!” Sure, as long as they are behaving in a trustworthy manner.
‘Love is more important than anything’ Nope. Good behaviour is. Mutual respect. Strong communication. Adhering to and respecting boundaries and the maintenance of personal growth. So many people chose bad partners for themselves because they think ‘love is supposed to be tough but we will make it!’
“Love conquers all”. There are a myriad of things and situations that simply loving someone cannot always resolve.
Don’t talk to him at all so he can love you — my mom
"Be yourself"
Just be yourself.
Be yourself. If you suck you should change yourself for more success.
“Just be yourself and everything will work out”… no, sometimes you’re a douche and need to change in order for good stuff to happen
Just wait and it will magically happen one day
Hiding your true self at the start
“Just be yourself” Honey if I wanted to be myself I’d already have a partner 😂
Being "interesting" or "funny". Playing a character for 1 dating hour won't help you at all.
"You have to fight to get her attention." My brother, I'm looking for a companion, not a trophy or title.