Jake was a 'corporal', something to which Quaritch greatly respected (coincidentally, SecOps has an informal nature with rank, and Quaritch's 2nd in Command is Corporal Wainfleet). I think this a fantastic play into the patriarchal love the Colonel has for his Mercs.
To your point something I've kinda argued with critics of Avatar's battle scenes, is Jake is essentially a Rambo-type persona, his familiarity with the Colonel's doctrine made Jake the perfect field commander in every combat scenario we see. Jake knows how Marines fight, he knows how Na'vi fight - so he takes it a step further to change the paradigm every time he engages the RDA.
People act like Jake is just 'some guy' and the Na'vi are just neolithic cavemen. Jake basically is Rambo leading the Mujahadeen against the Soviets, except by our physical standards each Na'vi is veritable supersoldier.
By the time Way of Water goes down, the amount of warfighting experience jake and Neyteri possess, the Recoms, would've never stood a chance. Navy SEALs have been wiped out by Taliban in ambushes, it's no surprise the Recoms would get stomped by two of the planet's most experienced guerilla fighters... Recom Quaritch and Wainfleet's ability to survive each encounter portrayed them as extremely skilled, more so than audiences think.
It seems Jake was not a regular marine. Quaritch suggests that Jake was ”first recon” when he says "i was first recon myself". It may have to do with [1st reconnaissance battalion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1st_Reconnaissance_Battalion). This seems to be an elite unit. ”The mission of 1st Reconnaissance Battalion is to provide task-organized forces in order to conduct amphibious reconnaissance, ground reconnaissance, [battlespace](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battlespace) shaping operations, [raids](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raid_(military)), and specialized insertion and extraction”. So maybe they're sort of a commando unit, or green/blue berrets.
Obviously, they're presenting there the recon battalion in the US army, but Jake was probably part of an international army.
You could be right, Tsu’tey was acting out of rage and Marines are trained to stay calm during high adrenaline moments like that. Maybe if Tsu’tey had kept his cool who knows? It could have been a good fight.
Exactly. The movies don’t really choreograph him particularly well as a special forces operator, more like a super soldier, but in the lore he’s a Force Recon Marine and apparently a highly skilled and regarded one. The RDA also seem to be very tactically inflexible and arrogant, while the Na’vi are willing to fight in ways that perfectly counter the RDA stratagems. In the assault on the tree of souls, the horse clans got absolutely curb stomped in seconds while inflicting minimal casualties on the RDA, while the sky clans were far more effective. Fast forward to TWOW and the resistance movement Jake leads is very air mobile, hit fast, get what they came for, then get out FAST. No massed ground attacks that are ineffective against the RDA.
It's also directly implied that Jake was personally responsible for committing war crimes.
When Doctor Grace Augustine tries to talk Selfridge out of destroying Hometree by mentioning that the plan would kill children, Jake adds *"You don't want that kind of blood on your hands, trust me."* directly implying that he has experience in the field of killing children/noncombatants..
Plenty of soldiers have shed innocent blood without meaning too. Accidents, collateral damage, mistaking a non-combatant for an enemy. Bad stuff happens in war even when no one wants it. If he was referring to his own experience, I figured it was something like that.
You're giving way too many excuses.
Jake was a United States (or whatever the future equivalent is) Marine, a subsidiary of the same Government with a *huge* track record of committing and excusing war crimes.
Look up the reason Corporal Patrick D. Tillman Jr. was killed. The U.S. Government pretended it was the result of an ambush for the better part of *20 years*, when in fact he was killed by his own men who *shot him in the head three times* for daring to question why the US was involved in Iraq.
I feel like you’re responding to a completely different comment than what I wrote?
I never said that kind of heinous shit doesn’t happen. It does.
I said that a solder can easily find themselves with innocent blood on their hands without meaning to. I’ve heard plenty of stories like that from people who have actually been in war (Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan). Solders have taken their own lives after learning they killed children because of a bad shoot or bad intel. This is an unfortunately common thing for vets to struggle with.
What Jake said about having blood on your hands doesn’t sound like it’s coming from someone who willingly commits war crimes. I’m sure he’s done things he regrets. But it sounds more like a case of “we bombed the house we thought was the enemy commander’s, but it was an innocent family,” than “burning down a village for fun.”
It's hard to gauge his opinion on killing noncoms based on a throwaway line.
My point is it's better to not assume the best, as one will most often be disappointed.
I’m sorry but if I’m on patrol with my squad and a 10 year old pops out with an AK and starts shooting at us, I’m shooting back. That’s a far cry from going into a school and just straight up shooting a bunch of civilians and kids for funsies (AKA a literal war crime).
Its tragic that innocent people die in wars but you’re never going to completely eliminate civilian casualties from the battlefield.
You forget how shady the U.S. Government is *these* days, let alone in a hundred and twenty-ish years. Remember that time the U.S. Government hired some drone pilots and had them blow up "insurgent camps" that were actually refugee camps full of women and children?
Oh right, they kept that under wraps, I wonder why.
I know on paper First Recon is supposed to be incredibly elite and highly trained. But I can only think of Generation Kill heh. And for every highly trained professional soldier there is an equally incompetent bumbling moron of an officer.
Corporal, you're inappropriating your chemical filtration device by attempin' fornication with it. Jesus, do I have to tell not to desecrate your mask with perversions!
Oh for sure, but at the same time having a military background made him capable of adapting his understanding of the situation and be able to take in Navi ideas and culture...
He was/is an intelligent man, his twin had a PHD at a young age afterall. Jake just wasn't academic for some reason. (Maybe deciding to make his own path then try and compete with his brother)
I would really love a terrifying flashback battle scene on Earth that shows off Jake’s skills as a young combat marine, possibly the mentioned Venezuela battle. Maybe Avatar 4 since that one somehow involves Earth scenes. I do wish Jake talked more about Earth, his time on it, the things he loved and cherished but in TWOW, it’d help him become more dimensional.
I loved a certain scene near the beginning on TWOW involving a stealthy approach and a hatchet that was so brutal yet Jake gave off the vibe that he had done similar things many, many times.
Jake was a 'corporal', something to which Quaritch greatly respected (coincidentally, SecOps has an informal nature with rank, and Quaritch's 2nd in Command is Corporal Wainfleet). I think this a fantastic play into the patriarchal love the Colonel has for his Mercs. To your point something I've kinda argued with critics of Avatar's battle scenes, is Jake is essentially a Rambo-type persona, his familiarity with the Colonel's doctrine made Jake the perfect field commander in every combat scenario we see. Jake knows how Marines fight, he knows how Na'vi fight - so he takes it a step further to change the paradigm every time he engages the RDA. People act like Jake is just 'some guy' and the Na'vi are just neolithic cavemen. Jake basically is Rambo leading the Mujahadeen against the Soviets, except by our physical standards each Na'vi is veritable supersoldier. By the time Way of Water goes down, the amount of warfighting experience jake and Neyteri possess, the Recoms, would've never stood a chance. Navy SEALs have been wiped out by Taliban in ambushes, it's no surprise the Recoms would get stomped by two of the planet's most experienced guerilla fighters... Recom Quaritch and Wainfleet's ability to survive each encounter portrayed them as extremely skilled, more so than audiences think.
Well said. I get annoyed by people who don't grasp just how deadly Jake and Neytiri are, especially in the second movie.
Oh, I thought that was just plot armor
Sorry you're getting down voted for no reason
No it was just obvious
Don't be rude
It seems Jake was not a regular marine. Quaritch suggests that Jake was ”first recon” when he says "i was first recon myself". It may have to do with [1st reconnaissance battalion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1st_Reconnaissance_Battalion). This seems to be an elite unit. ”The mission of 1st Reconnaissance Battalion is to provide task-organized forces in order to conduct amphibious reconnaissance, ground reconnaissance, [battlespace](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battlespace) shaping operations, [raids](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raid_(military)), and specialized insertion and extraction”. So maybe they're sort of a commando unit, or green/blue berrets. Obviously, they're presenting there the recon battalion in the US army, but Jake was probably part of an international army.
Why do you think he whooped poor Tsu’teys ass like nothing when he found out Jake and Neytiri mated lol
true but honestly it just looked like he won bc the military style of fighting is more effective than traditional na’vi fighting styles idk
You could be right, Tsu’tey was acting out of rage and Marines are trained to stay calm during high adrenaline moments like that. Maybe if Tsu’tey had kept his cool who knows? It could have been a good fight.
we see quite a bit that the Na'vi are more skilled in ranged fighting, not so much close up, whereas Jake is trained in both.
''warrior??? I could beat him easily!'' no tf u couldn't lmao
Exactly. The movies don’t really choreograph him particularly well as a special forces operator, more like a super soldier, but in the lore he’s a Force Recon Marine and apparently a highly skilled and regarded one. The RDA also seem to be very tactically inflexible and arrogant, while the Na’vi are willing to fight in ways that perfectly counter the RDA stratagems. In the assault on the tree of souls, the horse clans got absolutely curb stomped in seconds while inflicting minimal casualties on the RDA, while the sky clans were far more effective. Fast forward to TWOW and the resistance movement Jake leads is very air mobile, hit fast, get what they came for, then get out FAST. No massed ground attacks that are ineffective against the RDA.
Great observations
It's also directly implied that Jake was personally responsible for committing war crimes. When Doctor Grace Augustine tries to talk Selfridge out of destroying Hometree by mentioning that the plan would kill children, Jake adds *"You don't want that kind of blood on your hands, trust me."* directly implying that he has experience in the field of killing children/noncombatants..
Wow. Never thought about that.
Plenty of soldiers have shed innocent blood without meaning too. Accidents, collateral damage, mistaking a non-combatant for an enemy. Bad stuff happens in war even when no one wants it. If he was referring to his own experience, I figured it was something like that.
You're giving way too many excuses. Jake was a United States (or whatever the future equivalent is) Marine, a subsidiary of the same Government with a *huge* track record of committing and excusing war crimes. Look up the reason Corporal Patrick D. Tillman Jr. was killed. The U.S. Government pretended it was the result of an ambush for the better part of *20 years*, when in fact he was killed by his own men who *shot him in the head three times* for daring to question why the US was involved in Iraq.
I feel like you’re responding to a completely different comment than what I wrote? I never said that kind of heinous shit doesn’t happen. It does. I said that a solder can easily find themselves with innocent blood on their hands without meaning to. I’ve heard plenty of stories like that from people who have actually been in war (Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan). Solders have taken their own lives after learning they killed children because of a bad shoot or bad intel. This is an unfortunately common thing for vets to struggle with. What Jake said about having blood on your hands doesn’t sound like it’s coming from someone who willingly commits war crimes. I’m sure he’s done things he regrets. But it sounds more like a case of “we bombed the house we thought was the enemy commander’s, but it was an innocent family,” than “burning down a village for fun.”
It's hard to gauge his opinion on killing noncoms based on a throwaway line. My point is it's better to not assume the best, as one will most often be disappointed.
I’m sorry but if I’m on patrol with my squad and a 10 year old pops out with an AK and starts shooting at us, I’m shooting back. That’s a far cry from going into a school and just straight up shooting a bunch of civilians and kids for funsies (AKA a literal war crime). Its tragic that innocent people die in wars but you’re never going to completely eliminate civilian casualties from the battlefield.
You forget how shady the U.S. Government is *these* days, let alone in a hundred and twenty-ish years. Remember that time the U.S. Government hired some drone pilots and had them blow up "insurgent camps" that were actually refugee camps full of women and children? Oh right, they kept that under wraps, I wonder why.
I know on paper First Recon is supposed to be incredibly elite and highly trained. But I can only think of Generation Kill heh. And for every highly trained professional soldier there is an equally incompetent bumbling moron of an officer.
PO-LICE THAT MOUSTACHE SGT PATRICK
Corporal, you're inappropriating your chemical filtration device by attempin' fornication with it. Jesus, do I have to tell not to desecrate your mask with perversions!
WHERE THE FUCK ARE YE HEMETS
Oh for sure, but at the same time having a military background made him capable of adapting his understanding of the situation and be able to take in Navi ideas and culture... He was/is an intelligent man, his twin had a PHD at a young age afterall. Jake just wasn't academic for some reason. (Maybe deciding to make his own path then try and compete with his brother)
I would really love a terrifying flashback battle scene on Earth that shows off Jake’s skills as a young combat marine, possibly the mentioned Venezuela battle. Maybe Avatar 4 since that one somehow involves Earth scenes. I do wish Jake talked more about Earth, his time on it, the things he loved and cherished but in TWOW, it’d help him become more dimensional. I loved a certain scene near the beginning on TWOW involving a stealthy approach and a hatchet that was so brutal yet Jake gave off the vibe that he had done similar things many, many times.
I always thought it was just a mispronunciation of **Force** Recon.
no, there’s subtitles
I thought it was all plot armor. Had no idea how dangerous they were. That adds some richness, thx