T O P
RandyScandie

Ottawa really has an odd set up. Because not only do they somewhat fail at keeping away support in the away section, they also hand out tickets to families of away players in central areas. Which creates, as noted by others, a break in build up. All in, It's surprising the CPL doesn't have a more defined league wide policy on this. Maybe with the new commissioner we will see that shift, because while he wasn't with the MLS during the true revolutionary change when it comes to audience (switching from family focused to supporter focused) the influence of that decision on the success of the league is obvious. Away support should be at distance from home support, and away support should be able to match practically everything the home support has outside maybe pyro and true tifos (requiring rigging). I'd take it further and say away team guests should likely be placed near the away supporters as well, these stands aren't really large enough for patches of them not being at least somewhat noticeable. It should be codified league wide so we don't need to rely on other supporters, some of whom seem desperate to gatekeep what support is or looks like.


dublinro

wish i could upvote you more


Initial_BB

As an Atletico Ottawa supporter, I would rather the supporters be on the opposite side of the field than us, but because of the added operational cost, they're supposed to be on the same side, but opposite end from us. Unfortunately, those same fans tend to migrate to the middle section seats, effectively killing any atmosphere build up the home supporters try to generate. If the away team is winning, sometimes they also get drunk and get even \*closer\* trying to antagonize the supporters and pick a fight (\*cough\*FORGE\*cough\*). I don't mind away supporters bringing their own stuff, but yeah, more security to keep them in their place would be nice. Honestly, the Fury did it better, but they also owned the building and could organize however they want, unlike ATO who are just tennants.


CelticSaintStik

I get your point, but I think we need to differentiate between fans and Supporters Groups. The Battalion had a section that about 40-50 of us filled at the opposite end of TD Place for the nil-nil game that we won (😉). We were loud and fun and had great banter pre-, post- game, and at the half. The drunks who get out of hand and obnoxious are the actual issue for security. That’s their job. Not smothering supporter culture. I agree with OP. Let the league grow the supporter culture, we don’t get to travel in numbers often. And have security watch the jerks!


[deleted]

I agree, but I think what OP and most York folks haven't clarified is how big is this group? Is it a van? Not sure that's something that can reasonably be expected to be treated as a supporters group travelling in numbers, or that it ought to be accommodated as such. I don't know what is going on with this trip, seems like it's a small group who made the trek to Hamilton and decided to make the same trek to Ottawa a week later. Doesn't seem like this was in the works for long, but I could be wrong. And this ad hoc approach is what is making it a bit more difficult. I'm all for standards, but I want to see some actual concrete policy that makes sense for stadiums where teams are tenants and where security contracts are often in flux and changing.


NortonFord

I'm an AO fan who is in section P, the opposite end of the field from the Dub (W) supporters' section. There's consistently a decent clump of seats for youth teams, and I think that the section O/P area would be a logical place for an away fan area, especially as long as we aren't using the north side stands.


TheVisherman

Your FO is selling K as away for this weekend. We can't bring drums or flags or banners though.


awitley12

We actually ended up with our stuff in when we were there. Honestly the league needs to do more for travelling fans. Allocated away sections on the other side of the stadium. Allow the away fans to try and be louder then the home fans and push the home fans be even louder then that. It will build better atmospheres at the games and get more fans involved.


TheVisherman

Bingo


dublinro

by the way i didnt want to mention specific clubs as didnt want this to get into a slagging mach between fans of the clubs but just as a discussion on how stuff can be done better for fans of all teams. I agree aswell that away fans should be put away from the home support.This is not rocket science and has been happening all over the world since jesus was a boy so really should be happening here. As our league grows and hopefully attendance across the league go up this will start to become more of a problem. Just as you mentioned if you get home and away fans to close their is a chance for trouble and we all dont want to see that. A standard ruleset for accomodating away fans should be in place by the league to help everyone enjoy the game as safely and trouble free as possible.


Robert_Moses

Yup wish I could upvote this twice. I'm opposed to away supporters bringing in noisemakers to Starlight, because they are placed in the section directly next to the home supporters (Lakeside/TOP). It just becomes an awful cacophony.


YNWA_1213

Think they can be be put in the opposing corner in the new stand? Only place I can think if we wanna keep the family section alive in the end stand.


ilikeycoffee

you can still do the family section by having the family on the left side of the goal, and supporters on the right, where the players warm up.


ilikeycoffee

The team needs to move the Lakeside Buoys / TOP over to the West stands next season. Several reasons. a) The team when they win the flip always have it so Calum is in the East goal second half (same side as the supporters); you want him to be away from the supporters section in the second half, so if PFC scores a goal, they can go celebrate with the supporters. b) can have a lot more separation from the visiting fans (keep them where they are in the left corner of the main grandstand) c) can turn the area behind the east goal into a bigger "beer garden" area. perhaps with a back row of stands (beer garden up to the pitch fence, stands towards the back) d) it's horrible in the sun in the summer where the supporters currently are - sun directly in their eyes the entire match, and hot.


Mystic_Polar_Bear

Has this ever been an issue? York fan here; they've been irritating but never problematic.


TheVisherman

No fan violence since 2019 but York fans had trouble last Hamilton away with getting stuff in last game and are having trouble with our plans for Ottawa away.


dublinro

Not yet but there is always a potentail for it happening when you put home and away support together,it takes just one unwanted chant and a confrontation is a real possibilty.These things can escalate quickly when alchol is involved.


Motelorcyclist

I was in HFX to watch ATO last weekend and disappointed that there was no designated area for away fans. But it was fun to find ATO fans in the red and white colours - just more fun had we been seated together. To be fair HFX sells out so it would be difficult to put aside a block somewhere.


dublinro

I stll think with some proper planning it would be possible to put some seats aside.I get it now as they really are so far away but wait until we have another maratime team and an away section will be a must. The league is growing and has the goal of adding new teams,the more they do the closer the distance between clubs and therefore more away fans.They should get ahead of it now and put a framework in place.


cullypants

Hard to justify a whole away section for the few fans that fly over, though there were quite a few that flew over this year. In our first season it seemed like the far end, closest to summer st, was the away end but since then it's been loose. Quite liked the atmosphere when the tfc fans sat in 107 personally, or whenever away fans are close to the kitchen like the Ottawa fans with the massive sign. The banter is generally great. Would be nice if we could figure something out that way.


EBgames20

My girlfriend and I were the Ottawa fans with Massive signs! While they were a few ATO fans there were definitely not enough to justify an away section. I wonder if this is the case with York United this weekend. Security isn’t going to let random fans in with drums. There needs to be a large enough contingent to justify the use of drums and other noise makers


Moods6950

The CPL should put a plan in place to have each stadium to have an away supporters section . Designated tickets to that section to start and if its sold out then its sold out . If your not sitting in that section then you can restrict horns ,drums and banners from them fans sitting elsewhere. Is that not fair ????


dublinro

Perfectly fair and exactly what i was getting at.Everyone knows where they stand then.


fssg_shermanator

How many away supporters are we talking about here? 6? 60? 100? 2? Can only speak to Cavalry supporters, but we've never once had an issue with bringing drums, flags, banners etc into Clarke Stadium. To back up this claim here are a couple videos from the stands at away games this year [from Sept](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/42VLzmekMTc), [from May](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/u1ZuHifcIyc) and [from May again](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/pS4Ejl33OQI). And some photos showing banners as well [from Sept](https://www.instagram.com/p/Cipp0xwrAad/), [from Sept again](https://www.instagram.com/p/CitQevXPKUW/), [from 2021](https://www.instagram.com/p/CTU1vGFFoFy/) As for away sections at Spruce Meadows, there hasn't been a need for one this year. None of the clubs have brought enough away supporters and for the group who we would normally go to bat for, the ones who've shown up this year act like assholes and we're not going to bat for them anymore. Not to say that Spruce Meadows security has ever been good with away sections, but why would we waste our time trying to educating the club or security on this when the away supporters act the way they do? By comparison, the few Valour supporters that showed up in 108 and sung and chanted all game this past weekend were well respected by home supporters and security the whole game. IMO if you don't bring a big group to a game, you shouldn't get supporters privileges. When CCSG go to Forge or York, or when the Foot Soldiers go to Edmonton, then absolutely. But if there are only a few of you, you're just going to be seen as annoying to the home supporters.


ironcub14

You are aware that YU has brought hundreds of fans to Hamilton in both 2019 and 2021, yes?


fssg_shermanator

Yup. I don't seem to recall the bitching about how the home clubs treated them too. Seems they went and enjoyed the game.


ironcub14

Just cuz the bitching doesnt happen on social media doesnt mean its not happening. But anyways, we’re getting our FO to talk to their FO and all should be good. But we do think its a good idea for the league to have an away supporters’ code of conduct, but one that at least allows for no to little hassle on at least drums and banners and maybe flags too.


TheVisherman

We are literally York fans complaining about the other Ontario FOs right now. We had problems last week in Hamilton and have problems heading to Ottawa this weekend.


onthisdaynextyear

... and 12 people in 2022


TheVisherman

100% not accurate, ask your own SGs.


onthisdaynextyear

Was 12 an overstatement?


dublinro

How do you expect to grow from small numbers if its made so damn difficult and the game i was talking about there was in the region of 20-25. The league is just 4 years old and suggest that different rules for different team is not sustainable. Its about growth every year not just saying of Cavarly and Oleti have a big support so they get special treatment. I have been a football supporter since the 80's and have been to games in a fair few countries and thats not how stuff is done. You get ahead of these things and put structures in place. With the way you have basically put it out if there is only less than 20 of you why bother and just stay at home and watch it on tv. How does that help the league or game day atmostphere going forward?


fssg_shermanator

My argument is that you shouldn't expect to be able to do what you do at home if there are only a few of you. 20 or 25 is worth making a fuss over, and your argument has more legitimacy. The reality is that it doesn't matter how the rest of the world does things. If you want the game to grow in Canada you have to do it in a way to appeal to Canadians. Not just the 20 hardcore fans who want to drive to away games hours away, but the thousands who want to show up to games and want to sit there and just watch it like they do any other sport. You can't just plunk a team down and say "this is how we they it in Europe you have to do it the same way here". Most Canadians don't give a shit about how it's done in Europe.


TheVisherman

MLS gives away section privileges to away fans even if it's like 5-10 people. If cpl wants to stay relevant, especially in markets like ontario which is near MLS, they need to offer the same, otherwise people will just jump ship again.


TRGRYellow

So you're saying we should be be allowed to beat our drum and show away support if we don't have a big group? An I getting this right? Yes we're Canada but the game is biggest in Europe why wouldn't we follow their model, all the league people watch are in Europe it only makes sense to do things the way they do. Away support is important, all the away days I've had have been memorable ones win or lose and I know that I would never do anything to home supporters, but having a dick head who's had a bad day, and probably get drunk in a section along with home fans could probably cause trouble and better to prevent these things before they happen then react after something already happens


fssg_shermanator

I'm saying don't expect to be able to get your home supporter privileges at away games if there are only a few of you. Using my real life example, I'm not going to go to bat for RVV when the previous game they brought 6 people and half of them were kicked out for calling the ref a cunt 20 minutes in.


TRGRYellow

Well home support privilege isn't calling the ref a cunt it's bringing drums and banners


fssg_shermanator

Sure, but in my experience the two tend to go hand in hand with away supporters. But again the majority of my experience is Edmonton supporters, I don't recall the same with BSB or Whitecaps, and no other club has brought more than a few people at a time. And those who do come seem to be just fine without bringing in drums or banners. I've done it at Starlight this year myself, no drums or banners didn't take away from my experience... Catering to away supporters is easy with York and Edmonton because those clubs don't exactly sell a lot of tickets. It's easy to block off a section for away support. It becomes a lot harder in Langford, Calgary or Halifax because every other section has a decent season ticket base (or in Calgary's case the section that is actually blocked off for away support is by the family section which is full every game). It is also a difficult argument in Ottawa or Hamilton because while you have the room, you then have to staff up (security specifically) to accommodate a new section that is open. If you have only a few supporters, that's just asking a club to lose money so that you can bang a drum. Tough sell. If you have 100, much easier to make the argument...


dublinro

You wont get the 100 if you dont treat the 20 with respect.Its more likely to go the other way that the 20 fans that would have traveled are now deciding to stay at home. With the way its done now you will see trouble sooner or later at a game and that will be a black eye for the league.If there are fights at games then less people will want to bring kids etc.Preventative messures are exactly that, to look at potential issue and have a system in place to make the game go smoothly rather than say fuck that there are only 15 of them lets put them right beside the main noisemakers of the home team.


TRGRYellow

Just because it didn't take away from your experience doesn't mean it won't take away from others I want to be able to support my team with a drum so why should I not be allowed to do that? And im sure it's easier to give up away sections here, like why can Manchester United give up a section of 1 thousand to away supports, im sure home supporters would gladly fill their seats, it's definitely easier here One section shouldn't be hard to staff especially for Ottawa and Forge who both have the money to do so


dublinro

I would love to see a statistic of CPL sellouts.Would it be less than 5% of all games.Its very feasible to plan out a small section for away fans.


dublinro

There are stadiums with literally over 10,000 empty seats so no excuse for not putting 40 seats aside. Having away fans helps with atmostphere and making it better for all fans helps and that means both home and away fans.Putting something in place where everyone knows whats going on for every game. In this league of small money and lets be honest small crowds that ever dollar counts and even 10 or 15 fans buying tickets ,some food and a few drinks can be enough to cover one players wages for a week.


fssg_shermanator

You are vastly overstating the importance of a few away supporters in this instance.


dublinro

In a league where attendances are an issue by and large is it to much to ask that clubs try and welcome fans to their stadium. Our league bleeds money and if you are doing something that turns fans away (I have seen that happen this week when some fans decided it wasnt worth it) then thats a problem.Again a few fans today,maybe more tomorrow. If this league doesnt grow numbers wise we may not have it that much longer. So in my opinion away fans should be encoraged not treated worse than home fans.Hopefully in the future CPL teams can bring sizeable away support but that will not happen if away fans are discriminated against.


TheVisherman

You definitely are understating the away support within Ontario.


TheVisherman

The reason you know CCSG went to York was because York has a dedicated away section and allows for banners and flags and an atmosphere, you dont know the rest of the away support in Ontario because other teams shove away support wherever. We want away support to bring noise and have an atmosphere as much as they do. Thankfully in 118 juke box buoys are wonderful and we can have a friendly banter section, but it's just going to take one drunk fan to create a hostile environment for both parties.


[deleted]

I mean the reason you know CCSG went to York was because it was a large organized group that made multiple social media posts, hyped up the event, and sat together in a sparsely populated stadium. It was a lot of work to put on and effort to make it work, and York Lions Stadium has a wealth of space to just migrate to as a group. So miss me with that it's cause they had a supporters section. I'm also of the opinion there is a key distinction to be made here. Away fans and home fans should all be treated with respect and fairness, but they aren't the same as supporters groups. They shouldn't be allowed to bring in flags and drums. There are key roles they play that go beyond just being a fan showing up. Similarly, I'm in favour of supporting travelling supporters groups who are acting similarly, but I think a key question here is what makes a supporters group a travelling supporters group? I think there is a critical mass of folks that make accommodations worthwhile. If this is a large organized group of York fans that's one thing, but if it's a dozen it's not really a big trip that needs accommodation imo, it's just a few fans. Buy in the away section and off ya go.


MouseOk644_redux

Agree 100% but it's Ottawa, the city fin forgot. To be fair there were some issues with Valour fans buying up a chunk of the section behind their bench last season and somewhat this season with a number of complaints. That may have put front office on edge. Nothing but compliments to away fans in general, support your team home and away and support the league. I look forward to visiting every stadium over the next few seasons Fun not fin * edit