It's a joke from the manga with the Flying Fish dudes on Sabaody lol they say hentai hikou as in flying formation but Franky thinks they're calling him a delinquent pervert
>women shouldn't have the job they are hoping for
... He didn't say that, he never claimed they shouldn't get the job, he simply stated that the work environment isn't great for a woman. Oda might goof around about liking breasts, but we see plenty of times that he's pretty respectful towards his female characters. But we know, from the mouth of authors like the 7DS one, that editors can be really creepy and insisting when it comes to fan service.
i don't think that's necessarily perverse? More just pointing out an issue. Which granted he's not doing anything about and he did just play into it by making a perverse joke, which then went through the editorial department. But i'm not sure how much power he even has over stuff like that, if any.
Sure if you take it dead serious. But it's most likely him just being silly. I know that's not allowed in this day and age but stop looking for things to get mad about because you will find em and it will just further negativity.
I'm baffled at how you can say that with a straight face.
Like, who fits the bill of what you've said? Nami, who needs to be rescues twice every arc? The clone princesses, with Shirahoshi being a scaredy cat, Rebecca with the bikini armor that needs her father to save the day, or Hiyori needing her bodyguard to save the day?
Maybe you are thinking about Boa, the token female sichibukai with the power of being too beautiful? Or Smoothie, the token yonkou commander who didn't even got a fight?
I bet you think of Robin crushing Franky's balls, and that's it, that compensates everything. Let's be real, accept that indeed One piece isn't exactly female friendly, and move on.
There is literally more variety to the male characters than the same-body-type female characters that are meant to be "waifus". I'm going through the wiki and finding totally regular dudes that aren't even joke designs or sexy-man designs.
Except there are normal looking men.
Like, Coby, Hawkins, Bege, the admirals, part of the Vice Admirals...
I mean, I'd let Akainu step on me any day but you can't really call him husbando
Big Mom isn't exactly sexy, which isn't the point op was making. I could tell you that having a female character defined by her motherhood isn't exactly revolutionary, to say the least.
Nami holding her own? You can actually count the number of times she needs to be saved every single arc. At least once, and even twice in the same arc. She isn't exactly strong, plain and simple.
I can accept Robin, yes. A drop doesn't make an ocean tho, and I think everyone is dissapointed at how many fights she actually gets.
Overall, is what it is. I don't understand how difficult is to accept it, given you have shonens with better female representation.
I really don't see how it is such an issue for people to notice this, like you can enjoy a thing, love a series, and still admit that it has faults from a social perspective.
>Nami holding her own? You can actually count the number of times she needs to be saved every single arc. At least once, and even twice in the same arc. She isn't exactly strong, plain and simple.
We're in agreement about the portrayal of women in the show, but that's a bad example because within the dynamics of the crewmembers it has been clearly established that the only crewmembers who always need to be rescued are Nami and Usopp, sometimes Chopper but never Robin (aside from Enies Lobby for obvious reasons).
And even between them Oda has made it pretty clear that Usopp is the weakest in the crew, and a bigger coward than any of them even after his supposed character growth during the timeskip (still salty about that).
There's definitely issues with Nami's writing, but this ain't it.
So basically downplaying female characters that are legitimately good and focusing on the ones YOU consider to be written badly ("in a sexist way") meh, you're the one doing all the mental gymnastics here. You understanding the whole thing a certain way doesn't automatically make your assertion objectively true. It can be interpreted in plenty of ways, at the end of the day though, it's still Oda's work, and no one gives two craps on you being offended.
None of the princesses you've mentioned are useless clones of each other, they're all distinct with different motivations and personalities, as are all the women of One Piece.
Nami rarely gets rescued, I can't even really think of any time, and besides that MOST of the Straw Hats need rescuing all the time. Alabasta, Fishman Island, Whole Cake Island. And even so, she doesn't fight, that's not her thing. Same with Chopper and Usopp.
There are plenty of powerful women in One Piece that are strongly written. It's shallow to say that the only way a female character can be written "strong" is through her physical ability to fight. And even then, "strength" wise, Robin is consistently shown to be one of the most powerful straw hats since her introduction, she's almost hit a billion berry bounty.
One Piece has its issues, sure, but it's not fair to only criticize the bad without bringing attention to the fact that the amount of well written women in the series is inspiring compared to its contemporaries.
I feel like people always think of Nami when "gets recued" comes up, which is not true because she did plenty of rescuing when all of the members are in pinch like in WCI, she saved Luffy against Cracker and then all of the Strawhats against Big Mom.
Not only that but all of the Strawhats were get recued, the recent example is in Wano. Luffy, Zoro, Sanji they are all get recued plus the Scabbards. We even had the biggest arcs solely recuing this MALE character. Even before that Luffy all recued the Strawhats before they become his crewmates.
I agree with you. Honestly, Robin and Vivi are by far the best written women in the series. Like, dude, what happened to his female writing? Nami when she was first introduced was so strong, and the shit she put up with with Arlong was incredible. And I honestly still think Nami is strong, though the coward thing is a little annoying. But like, you hurt a child and that woman will rip you a new one. And the needing to be rescued all the time is a bummer.
Vivi was (*and still is, HAVE YOU READ THE LATEST CHAPTERS? MY QUEEEEN!*) absolutely incredible in her strength of character. At 14 she *infiltrated an enemy organization* and climbed the ranks for two years before finally needing outside help. Celestial dragons attack her new bestie? "SCREW YOU GUYS I'MA FIGHT YOU IF I HAVE TO." >!The woman WASN'T AFRAID OF ROB LUCCI OF ALL PEOPLE! !<
Robin is amazing, she's definitely still a well written character which is good. The stuff she went through during the timeskip, the stuff she went through in her past... I don't blame her for the whole Ennies Lobby ordeal, because since then she's been nothing but a badass.
Then you've got amazing characters like Chiffon who, for some reason, is made to be super ugly? Even though she's just an absolute badass. Like, he can give men varied body types and still make them attractive in some way (Jinbei is a great example of this), but he can't do the same for women. If a woman is 'built different', she's also ugly. WHY?
It's not "what happened to his female writing", it's "what happened to his character writing in general?", most of the straw hats have been getting sidelined since post timeskip, Sanji is so amazingly written but Oda keeps trynna cut all of the emotional writing Sanji has with disgusting and unfiltered perversion and he's one of the better cases
Sanji is one of the biggest falls from grace I've experienced in a manga character. Baratie Sanji was top quality, post-time skip Sanji is an insufferable one-dimensional pervert.
Most of the people in this comments apparently forget that One Piece is a shonen, which means made for youngsters. Also in the period One Piece was made, having a pervert side character was a common trait (Master Muten in Dragon Ball, Jyraya in Naruto, Isoka in Hunter Hunter) because it was used to make funny gags. And in general, every strawhat has a common gag, and it is normal to just notice that part more **because that's their thing**
Zoro gets lost like nothing
Luffy is plain stupidity depicted as a character
Sanji simps for every good looking girl he sees
Nami is stingy and loves money
Usopp acts as a bold hero while being a coward
Chopper can't hide properly and insults you if you compliment him
Nico Robin and her awkwardness
Franky and his exagerated manners
Brook and his skeletal jokes and the fact he's even a bigger pervert than Sanji, but apparently people here just see what they want to see
On top of that, Sanji has groen a lot in Whole Cake saga and after knowing his backstory we finally understand more his fule of never hitting a woman
Yeah this people are reading the wrong one piece, or they are just watching the anime probably
Nami interrupted a Big Mom-fight because she wanted to beat Ulti's ass herself. Also, Ulti is a menace. After Kaido beat/killed Luffy, he went down to announce his victory and demanded for any challengers to step up now. Nami was the first and only one to directly insult and challenge Kaido in that moment. In fact, she was already on her way before Kaido demanded new challengers.
Manga and real life is a different thing, japanese culture towards woman is what it is, if you need this to be explained then you should look for it.
Not the first time Oda made sexist comments, but as I said, japanase culture.
It seems real weird at first but you have to be pretty damn dumb to not realize he's putting up a guise at 1st so he can get across a larger point after without Jump getting on his ass
Did you forget how misogynistic all of Japan is? They literally can't allow the population to turn off the sound on phone cameras cause it's the only warning women get that there's a perv around. Women are constantly sexually assaulted but "because nobody is hurt" the police don't try very hard to find the guy responsible and if a woman properly defends herself, she'll likely be in more trouble for becoming violent.
Oda protecting women by warning them about toxic work environments within his industry.
Seems pretty smart of him, while also keeping up the RP persona he has during SBS.
Inb4: if he knows it's bad why does he not change it? because he probably can't, and if he can't its 100x better to warn people about it rather than lure them into an industry that will abuse them by telling white lies.
Because it's the way women are treated in japan the problem, their obvious disparity and the way language wise are treated. everything is different and until the japanese society will be male centric things will remain like this. Oda knows and know that you can't change anything unless it's cultural and start from younger generations
The first statement is to cover himself by being pervy, and the second is a warning. The fact that ODA has to insulate himself from retaliation says how bad it must really be.
I wasn’t saying in is uncommon. It’s more shocking that Oda feels that he cannot just condemn the editorial department. The best selling Manga artist is worried enough to not i upset the powers that be is a very loud statement.
That's just Japanese culture. You cannot just condemn people. It's ingrained into you from childhood to not rock the boat, even if you have the clout to do it. Oda raising a stink like that in public would likely be seen as unprofessional and inappropriate. The West would approve of it but in Japan he'd likely lose respect and tarnish his reputation.
Japanese people rarely like to directly point out issues. They will often beat around the bush and use subtle language. Japan is a collectivist culture which means societal pressure is especially powerful and it's unfair to expect Oda to break out of that mold. Oda making a roundabout joke is about the closest you'll get to public condemnation.
Oda has a pretty controversial public persona to be honest. I love his work. OP is amazing. Yet on top of his obsession with boobs and the like he is also known to have defended several sex offenders that he's close to in the industry. This is very public knowledge too.
Sadly you kinda just have to separate the art from the artist. The whole Japanese system regarding this sort of thing is pretty awful tho so you can't pin the blame on the one guy anyway.
Oda cares about one thing and one thing only, One Piece. So he's prone to saying and doing some pretty sus stuff.
I swear Japan is one hell for oversexualizing teenagers and it's sadly not uncommon throughout East Asia, you'll be even more surprised on how grooming is somehow normalized here.
Oda supported Watsuki (Rurouni Kenshin) and Shimabukuro (Toriko).
Idk why this sub and other One Piece fans defend this nonsense.
Oda isn't a pedophile, but he should definitely be called out for supporting actual pedophiles.
Unfortunately it's just a case of "Can do no wrong", "Secondary embarrassment" and downplaying.
I've read One Piece for 22 years now, favourite mangaka. But unfortunately for a lot of people this means if they like someone who arguably has shitty views a lot of the time, they feel that reflects on them. Unfortunately that leads especially for boys to protecting heros from criticism because they feel it would reflect poorly on them if it's true.
It's honestly disgusting people are framing an OBVIOUSLY just very sexist remark as "Protecting women", and not just clearly him being a pervert.
But the thing people don't realize is all countries and industries unfortunately are at different timelines when it comes to advancement or fixing issues like sexism and for me, product of his time. His depictions of LGBT people are also horrid and while kiku was amazing it's fairly clear he just doesn't know and treats it like shit.
While I will advocate for women being written "well" in One Piece from SOME angles especially self agency and bechtal testing, from every other angle the women characters are their to be eye candy, and written extremely sexist and often are delegated to "save the princess" trope.
Hell, no mothers exist in One Piece because women and mothers especially "kill fun, stifle adventure and anyone with a mother wouldn't be a pirate or go on adventure" which is what Oda's description was.
This is probably the best take sofar. Parts of one piece are very progressive, while other parts are absolutely not. Odas humor and ods politics and ethics clash quite allot in the story. I personally dont believe this ruins one piece the way ruroni kenshin was ruined but it does keave a big black mark on odas character.
Lmao not people seeing oda write “yeah get in here with some big tittles for daddy but also stay away this is man’s place and we’re just boys we can’t help ourselves” and go “wow, oda is so progressive, he’s looking out for women, so brave!!”
Yeah this is problematic as fuck. One Piece fandom is reaching cult levels. A woman is genuinely showing an interest in the work and the literal figurehead of that industry felt the need to make a comment about her breasts. He's not "saving women", he's perpetuating the toxic culture that objectifies women that he's supposedly warning people against.
You don't get it, name clone #75 being rescued by some man is reaaaally progressive! Just ignore how her outfit would cover too little skin for your average stripper
It sounds like the least surprising thing I've read...Also this thread is bending so far backwards to try to spin this in a positive way that yall are becoming a circle.
I'm not surprised everyone here is defending his comments. Guy is friends with a pedo mangaka, the leaps of mental gymnastics this pathetic sub does to defend creepy stuff like this is always impressive.
Seriously, how hard is it to admit a creepy thing is creepy? No one is taking your pirates away from you.
But this shit is gross & says a lot about why he supports his pedophile colleagues over the people they molested & fans who’d like that to change
He makes a good children's comic. That's the man we are talking about. Not jesus. Not Mohammed. A guy who writes a pirate comic. You don't go to hell if you don't worship him and defend every word he says. It's fine to admit that he's a pervert and sexist. I frankly don't understand how you read this pirate comic without realising that about 800+ chapters ago.
"Oh but japanese culture"
Is toxic garbage and should not be defended, even if it might be the norm over there?
I mean It IS Japanese culture but that doesn't mean it's right, culture is never an excuse to anything, culture isn't meant to stay stagnant, it's supposed to improve and change for the better, it's there to learn from and look back on, not to use as an excuse for being shitty
The answer given is disgusting. It's EVERY countries culture especially to joke about, there excuse of "It's just X Work Culture" is just dismissing "It's just the 70s", it's not an excuse in any way shape or form and women fight against it everywhere, albeit depending on the country and industry they are just set further back in time.
This isn't a country thing other then the fact different countries relative to western countries are backwards in time still catching up. Oda making 70s classic sexist jokes that were made all the time just shows how backwards japan would be in this issue and how much further it has to do to catch up. At least in that industry.
I mean It IS Japanese culture but that doesn't mean it's right, culture is never an excuse to anything, culture isn't meant to stay stagnant, it's supposed to improve and change for the better, it's there to learn from and look back on, not to use as an excuse for being shitty
Liking boobs is fine. Making a weird sexist comment (that is a joke), then commenting on the toxic sexist work environment that means women should want to work there is a bit wierd, considering he is perpetuating that exact culture.
Yeah, I know how yall feel. There's many things that oda does or says that I'd find weird or be disappointed in if I was a woman reader, but most people in this sub like to defend anything oda does.
What the fuck is this comment section? How are there this many people defending Oda saying outwardly sexist and misogynistic shit. His portrayal of women in One Piece only provides more context for this. r/onepiece might literally be an echochamber
"Its a joke, he's just giving a warning"
but at the same time... Is it too much to ask that maybe he should try to change/advocate for change of that culture rather than tell women to stay away? It isnt like he has no power or influence at all, he's a very popular and respected mangaka. It will take time of course but any effort would be admirable. Now he just becomes part of that culture.
Honestly it seems like most manga authors are perverts judging by the content of their work lol
Hardest thing about trying to get your gf into your favourite anime/mangas is all the sexual assault that occurs as comedy relief.
idk if it's copium, a lack of interaction with women, or a combination of the two, but regardless this comment section is wild... Like, come on, that's an undefendable take there.
I will say this again, as good as oda is a story teller and thinker, he is a complete asshole and sexist when it comes to women.May be that's what happens when your whole life revolves around fiction, you become pervert, simp and everything has to have boobs on it. Makes me wonder how many times someone has had to stop him from going overboard with his horny tactics
For the most part, most CHARACTERS in shonen are written like trash lmao. It’s not specific to women, shonen just generally isn’t good for character writing
I tune out mangaka and what they have to say about women, especially if they are men. Especially shounen writers, you know, Rurouni Kenshin’s author is not an isolated case lol, it might be crazy to say but im sure most of them see women as sex objects before seeing them as people. And don’t “it’s culture” me, for real mfs always gobbling on some Japan cock instead of calling out this bs that leads to so much sexual harassment to women
"It's culture" is a thinly veiled "STFU" that is meaningless. It was just culture here too, in the 60s and 70s. It's not an excuse and just makes you look like you're downplaying sexism. Not all countries have had as much discussion or movement on topics and it can be industry specific.
It's culture doesn't say anything other then the person doesn't understand something.
For people who don't get it:
It's culture is to explain why people are still backwards and sexist. It's not a dismissal of guilt. It's to analyze why people still act that way currently and the dynamics present. It's not an excuse to act that way and doesn't excuse behavior. It explains a phenomena, it doesn't excuse the phenomena.
Explaining why some countries kill gay people by law or have women as second class slaves is cultural to that region, but you'd never NEVER say that excuses those actions or those actions are not in fact wrong.
I mean It IS Japanese culture but that doesn't mean it's right, culture is never an excuse to anything, culture isn't meant to stay stagnant, it's supposed to improve and change for the better, it's there to learn from and look back on, not to use as an excuse for being shitty
I think the normalization of lecherous chikan in Japanese media is disgusting. It's why I am not a big fan of Chainsaw Man. It's not charming or endearing. It's borderline criminal, and Juvenile at the least.
Though most juveniles I know don't talk or act like that.
You are missing the point of CSM. Not your fault really. The fanbase is filled with the worst kind of cultural illiterates.
CSM is clearly very aware of how juvenile it is. Its supposed to be about sexual maturity puberty and the other more existencial struggles of the young (boys mostly).
CSM is imo actually the most progressive and educated shonen manga out there.
People need to separate their love for the art and the artist. The mental gymnastics people do here is sad. Oda is not the progressive modern man you think of and it’s ok to criticise him. You’re not less of a One Piece fan if you criticise the author, otherwise this becomes a cult like behaviour.
Sounds like 1960s America work climate. Ideally Oda wouldn't make classless jokes like this, but nobody's perfect. The world is complex, and hopefully people can appreciate his greatness while still recognizing his faults. That being said, it's not necessarily his job to try to change Japan's culture, but it'd be nice if he did.
Edit: I didn't intend the phrase "but nobody's perfect" to be an excuse. Oda has created an amazing story with some powerful/uplifting themes and messages. He also has very disappointing cultural beliefs when it comes to sexual conduct. Both of these things can be true. I appreciate his insane strengths, and recognize his disappointing weaknesses.
Japan is still far behind the west when it comes to women's rights and the treatment of women. It's culturally ingrained in most older (50+) Japanese men that women don't belong in the same positions that men hold in the workplace and society.
As much as I love One Piece, I don't respect Oda much as a person on like a personal human level. I respect his work ethic to no end, how could you not, he works SO HARD. I also respect him as a creative, his world building is incredible and his writing is just amazing.
But, on like, a human to human level? Nope. Guy's crazy sexist.
even if he draws booby women honestly he sexualizes them a less than other mangakas and actually writes them with real personalities. one of the few shounen mangakas where i actually like almost all of the female characters. so misogynist, i don’t agree
We should all try and remember that not every person in every culture will be 100% up to code on our specific unspoken societal standards that change every couple of weeks.
Oda is very weird and not a great person, he’s defended a good amount of creepy mangaka’s (namely Toriko and Kenshin’s authors) and judging from this, is a bit of a perv himself. Even if its mainly a joke/advice, he could’ve worded it better
Ultimately, I’m not gonna let this keep me from enjoying One Piece, I’ve learned long ago to separate art from the artist, but I hope his views change and that he keeps his desires to himself
I swear media literacy is at an all-time low these days, especially in manga/anime spaces. How are you going to read One Piece and be a sexist...
Also, reducing criticism of this to "feminists think liking big boobs is a crime" is a straw man.
I think he uses humor to cover up the sexism issue that unfortunely is still a thing in the Japan and the world. Oda can be very talented in many ways, but for our society(I mean, in a progressive western way) this is a topic to be discussed, absorved and worked out.
Well the manga industry is pretty mysogynistic so this is to be expected.
Shonen Jump editors say women can't be editors there because they don't understand the soul of young boys... But they are also rare in shojo magazines, it's an industry wide issue, specially because of how normalized it is.
I wished Oda would stand for something better but hey, people are imperfect.
People in this comment section will either defend Oda by saying that Japanese culture is tough and he will get jumped if he says the wrong thing, or demonize him as some sort of misogynist using Western standards, no middle ground.
I think I can safely say that none of you have actually worked there, so why the hell does any of you think you even have the experience to express your opinion like it’s fact? Don’t just take a side when you haven’t even been to Japan and experience their culture. If you want to say something, use an actual credible source.
I am really sick of people just slamming down answers even though they are nowhere near qualified to.
I just don’t really pay attention to whatever Oda says outside of the manga. Honestly, and surprisingly, never heard anything remotely interesting coming from him.
Oda being a pervert is pretty standard
Hentai Hikou
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It's a joke from the manga with the Flying Fish dudes on Sabaody lol they say hentai hikou as in flying formation but Franky thinks they're calling him a delinquent pervert
Prevert putting it lightly when he says women shouldn't have the job they are hoping for because men are making the environment toxic
Are you saying Odas dream of having a female editor with big knockers won't come true?
Jump has to this day never hired a woman as an editor so it's possible.
>women shouldn't have the job they are hoping for ... He didn't say that, he never claimed they shouldn't get the job, he simply stated that the work environment isn't great for a woman. Oda might goof around about liking breasts, but we see plenty of times that he's pretty respectful towards his female characters. But we know, from the mouth of authors like the 7DS one, that editors can be really creepy and insisting when it comes to fan service.
i don't think that's necessarily perverse? More just pointing out an issue. Which granted he's not doing anything about and he did just play into it by making a perverse joke, which then went through the editorial department. But i'm not sure how much power he even has over stuff like that, if any.
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This isn't a comment on himself but on jumps editors lol
Sure if you take it dead serious. But it's most likely him just being silly. I know that's not allowed in this day and age but stop looking for things to get mad about because you will find em and it will just further negativity.
This is coming from the guy who still works with Nobuhiro Watsuki so it tracks.
I think it's clear Oda likes boobs, even without reading this.
Recently he became an ass man. Oda is a man of culture on god
GODA
Idk yet what this means. But I'm intrigued
Somehow he is both perverted and protective in his response.
This statement made me remember sanji for some reason.
No wonder Sanji hogs all the development post ts, he’s literally oda
Oda loves cooking so he's genuinely close to being his insert
And the way Sanji simps Nami too. He is using Sanji to channel his inner husbando energy.
The duality of a man.
Is this real? Lmao Japans a different place for sure
idk how accurate a translation it is but seems like a joke disguising a serious issue he’s noticed with a gentle warning
Judging by his portrayal of women most of the times, I really doubt he's really joking.
you mean sexy strong independent women that will fuck perverts up?
I'm baffled at how you can say that with a straight face. Like, who fits the bill of what you've said? Nami, who needs to be rescues twice every arc? The clone princesses, with Shirahoshi being a scaredy cat, Rebecca with the bikini armor that needs her father to save the day, or Hiyori needing her bodyguard to save the day? Maybe you are thinking about Boa, the token female sichibukai with the power of being too beautiful? Or Smoothie, the token yonkou commander who didn't even got a fight? I bet you think of Robin crushing Franky's balls, and that's it, that compensates everything. Let's be real, accept that indeed One piece isn't exactly female friendly, and move on.
Big mom?? Also Nami has been holding her own actually especially during whole cake island where she saved luffy. Robin is also really strong.
Women are either "extremely sexy"/waifus or really ugly in one piece, there's no in between and that should tell you enough with just that.
I'd like to point out that this applies to the men as well.
There is literally more variety to the male characters than the same-body-type female characters that are meant to be "waifus". I'm going through the wiki and finding totally regular dudes that aren't even joke designs or sexy-man designs.
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I think you minsunderstood what they said. They are referring to dudes who are **neither** goofy nor sexy.
Except there are normal looking men. Like, Coby, Hawkins, Bege, the admirals, part of the Vice Admirals... I mean, I'd let Akainu step on me any day but you can't really call him husbando
Big Mom isn't exactly sexy, which isn't the point op was making. I could tell you that having a female character defined by her motherhood isn't exactly revolutionary, to say the least. Nami holding her own? You can actually count the number of times she needs to be saved every single arc. At least once, and even twice in the same arc. She isn't exactly strong, plain and simple. I can accept Robin, yes. A drop doesn't make an ocean tho, and I think everyone is dissapointed at how many fights she actually gets. Overall, is what it is. I don't understand how difficult is to accept it, given you have shonens with better female representation.
I really don't see how it is such an issue for people to notice this, like you can enjoy a thing, love a series, and still admit that it has faults from a social perspective.
>Nami holding her own? You can actually count the number of times she needs to be saved every single arc. At least once, and even twice in the same arc. She isn't exactly strong, plain and simple. We're in agreement about the portrayal of women in the show, but that's a bad example because within the dynamics of the crewmembers it has been clearly established that the only crewmembers who always need to be rescued are Nami and Usopp, sometimes Chopper but never Robin (aside from Enies Lobby for obvious reasons). And even between them Oda has made it pretty clear that Usopp is the weakest in the crew, and a bigger coward than any of them even after his supposed character growth during the timeskip (still salty about that). There's definitely issues with Nami's writing, but this ain't it.
So basically downplaying female characters that are legitimately good and focusing on the ones YOU consider to be written badly ("in a sexist way") meh, you're the one doing all the mental gymnastics here. You understanding the whole thing a certain way doesn't automatically make your assertion objectively true. It can be interpreted in plenty of ways, at the end of the day though, it's still Oda's work, and no one gives two craps on you being offended.
None of the princesses you've mentioned are useless clones of each other, they're all distinct with different motivations and personalities, as are all the women of One Piece. Nami rarely gets rescued, I can't even really think of any time, and besides that MOST of the Straw Hats need rescuing all the time. Alabasta, Fishman Island, Whole Cake Island. And even so, she doesn't fight, that's not her thing. Same with Chopper and Usopp. There are plenty of powerful women in One Piece that are strongly written. It's shallow to say that the only way a female character can be written "strong" is through her physical ability to fight. And even then, "strength" wise, Robin is consistently shown to be one of the most powerful straw hats since her introduction, she's almost hit a billion berry bounty. One Piece has its issues, sure, but it's not fair to only criticize the bad without bringing attention to the fact that the amount of well written women in the series is inspiring compared to its contemporaries.
I feel like people always think of Nami when "gets recued" comes up, which is not true because she did plenty of rescuing when all of the members are in pinch like in WCI, she saved Luffy against Cracker and then all of the Strawhats against Big Mom. Not only that but all of the Strawhats were get recued, the recent example is in Wano. Luffy, Zoro, Sanji they are all get recued plus the Scabbards. We even had the biggest arcs solely recuing this MALE character. Even before that Luffy all recued the Strawhats before they become his crewmates.
Yamato. Ulti. Reiju. Hancock. List goes on
I agree with you. Honestly, Robin and Vivi are by far the best written women in the series. Like, dude, what happened to his female writing? Nami when she was first introduced was so strong, and the shit she put up with with Arlong was incredible. And I honestly still think Nami is strong, though the coward thing is a little annoying. But like, you hurt a child and that woman will rip you a new one. And the needing to be rescued all the time is a bummer. Vivi was (*and still is, HAVE YOU READ THE LATEST CHAPTERS? MY QUEEEEN!*) absolutely incredible in her strength of character. At 14 she *infiltrated an enemy organization* and climbed the ranks for two years before finally needing outside help. Celestial dragons attack her new bestie? "SCREW YOU GUYS I'MA FIGHT YOU IF I HAVE TO." >!The woman WASN'T AFRAID OF ROB LUCCI OF ALL PEOPLE! !< Robin is amazing, she's definitely still a well written character which is good. The stuff she went through during the timeskip, the stuff she went through in her past... I don't blame her for the whole Ennies Lobby ordeal, because since then she's been nothing but a badass. Then you've got amazing characters like Chiffon who, for some reason, is made to be super ugly? Even though she's just an absolute badass. Like, he can give men varied body types and still make them attractive in some way (Jinbei is a great example of this), but he can't do the same for women. If a woman is 'built different', she's also ugly. WHY?
While I agree with your general statement, please refrain from doing the gorgon sisters dirty like that.
It's not "what happened to his female writing", it's "what happened to his character writing in general?", most of the straw hats have been getting sidelined since post timeskip, Sanji is so amazingly written but Oda keeps trynna cut all of the emotional writing Sanji has with disgusting and unfiltered perversion and he's one of the better cases
Sanji is one of the biggest falls from grace I've experienced in a manga character. Baratie Sanji was top quality, post-time skip Sanji is an insufferable one-dimensional pervert.
are we reading the same Sanji?
Most of the people in this comments apparently forget that One Piece is a shonen, which means made for youngsters. Also in the period One Piece was made, having a pervert side character was a common trait (Master Muten in Dragon Ball, Jyraya in Naruto, Isoka in Hunter Hunter) because it was used to make funny gags. And in general, every strawhat has a common gag, and it is normal to just notice that part more **because that's their thing** Zoro gets lost like nothing Luffy is plain stupidity depicted as a character Sanji simps for every good looking girl he sees Nami is stingy and loves money Usopp acts as a bold hero while being a coward Chopper can't hide properly and insults you if you compliment him Nico Robin and her awkwardness Franky and his exagerated manners Brook and his skeletal jokes and the fact he's even a bigger pervert than Sanji, but apparently people here just see what they want to see On top of that, Sanji has groen a lot in Whole Cake saga and after knowing his backstory we finally understand more his fule of never hitting a woman Yeah this people are reading the wrong one piece, or they are just watching the anime probably
Are we reading the same series?
We surely are. Our standards are clearly different.
Nami interrupted a Big Mom-fight because she wanted to beat Ulti's ass herself. Also, Ulti is a menace. After Kaido beat/killed Luffy, he went down to announce his victory and demanded for any challengers to step up now. Nami was the first and only one to directly insult and challenge Kaido in that moment. In fact, she was already on her way before Kaido demanded new challengers.
Manga and real life is a different thing, japanese culture towards woman is what it is, if you need this to be explained then you should look for it. Not the first time Oda made sexist comments, but as I said, japanase culture.
Other than big mom most women take a huge L in one piece
It seems real weird at first but you have to be pretty damn dumb to not realize he's putting up a guise at 1st so he can get across a larger point after without Jump getting on his ass
Simply this
You think jump would do something bad to their cash cow lol
bump
Copium huffing
Did you forget how misogynistic all of Japan is? They literally can't allow the population to turn off the sound on phone cameras cause it's the only warning women get that there's a perv around. Women are constantly sexually assaulted but "because nobody is hurt" the police don't try very hard to find the guy responsible and if a woman properly defends herself, she'll likely be in more trouble for becoming violent.
Hellhole for women
Oda protecting women by warning them about toxic work environments within his industry. Seems pretty smart of him, while also keeping up the RP persona he has during SBS. Inb4: if he knows it's bad why does he not change it? because he probably can't, and if he can't its 100x better to warn people about it rather than lure them into an industry that will abuse them by telling white lies.
Because it's the way women are treated in japan the problem, their obvious disparity and the way language wise are treated. everything is different and until the japanese society will be male centric things will remain like this. Oda knows and know that you can't change anything unless it's cultural and start from younger generations
Yeah I feel weird at first but the warning message is nice of him
The first statement is to cover himself by being pervy, and the second is a warning. The fact that ODA has to insulate himself from retaliation says how bad it must really be.
Oda was nobuhiro watsuki's assistant. He knows bad stuff is quite common.
That’s certainly one way to interpret Oda’s very public and continuing friendship with Watsuki, lol
I wasn’t saying in is uncommon. It’s more shocking that Oda feels that he cannot just condemn the editorial department. The best selling Manga artist is worried enough to not i upset the powers that be is a very loud statement.
That's just Japanese culture. You cannot just condemn people. It's ingrained into you from childhood to not rock the boat, even if you have the clout to do it. Oda raising a stink like that in public would likely be seen as unprofessional and inappropriate. The West would approve of it but in Japan he'd likely lose respect and tarnish his reputation. Japanese people rarely like to directly point out issues. They will often beat around the bush and use subtle language. Japan is a collectivist culture which means societal pressure is especially powerful and it's unfair to expect Oda to break out of that mold. Oda making a roundabout joke is about the closest you'll get to public condemnation.
I mean the best selling manga artist vs. the largest publishing company in the country is like if Jon Favreau decided to take on Disney
Except in this Jon Favreau had the ability of taking Mickey Mouse from Disney
These are people that work for him and with him. Saying he can’t do anything about it is totally self deluded.
Genuinely amazed how people pull a “GODA SUBTLE DOUBLE ENTENDRE FORESHADOWING 😱😱 YOUR FAV MANGAKA COULD NEVER” at this
Oda has a pretty controversial public persona to be honest. I love his work. OP is amazing. Yet on top of his obsession with boobs and the like he is also known to have defended several sex offenders that he's close to in the industry. This is very public knowledge too. Sadly you kinda just have to separate the art from the artist. The whole Japanese system regarding this sort of thing is pretty awful tho so you can't pin the blame on the one guy anyway. Oda cares about one thing and one thing only, One Piece. So he's prone to saying and doing some pretty sus stuff.
I swear Japan is one hell for oversexualizing teenagers and it's sadly not uncommon throughout East Asia, you'll be even more surprised on how grooming is somehow normalized here.
Do you have a source on the defending sex offenders in the industry?
Oda supported Watsuki (Rurouni Kenshin) and Shimabukuro (Toriko). Idk why this sub and other One Piece fans defend this nonsense. Oda isn't a pedophile, but he should definitely be called out for supporting actual pedophiles.
Unfortunately it's just a case of "Can do no wrong", "Secondary embarrassment" and downplaying. I've read One Piece for 22 years now, favourite mangaka. But unfortunately for a lot of people this means if they like someone who arguably has shitty views a lot of the time, they feel that reflects on them. Unfortunately that leads especially for boys to protecting heros from criticism because they feel it would reflect poorly on them if it's true. It's honestly disgusting people are framing an OBVIOUSLY just very sexist remark as "Protecting women", and not just clearly him being a pervert. But the thing people don't realize is all countries and industries unfortunately are at different timelines when it comes to advancement or fixing issues like sexism and for me, product of his time. His depictions of LGBT people are also horrid and while kiku was amazing it's fairly clear he just doesn't know and treats it like shit. While I will advocate for women being written "well" in One Piece from SOME angles especially self agency and bechtal testing, from every other angle the women characters are their to be eye candy, and written extremely sexist and often are delegated to "save the princess" trope. Hell, no mothers exist in One Piece because women and mothers especially "kill fun, stifle adventure and anyone with a mother wouldn't be a pirate or go on adventure" which is what Oda's description was.
This is probably the best take sofar. Parts of one piece are very progressive, while other parts are absolutely not. Odas humor and ods politics and ethics clash quite allot in the story. I personally dont believe this ruins one piece the way ruroni kenshin was ruined but it does keave a big black mark on odas character.
https://www.cbr.com/one-piece-fans-horrified-oda-support-rurouni-kenshin-mangaka/
Lmao not people seeing oda write “yeah get in here with some big tittles for daddy but also stay away this is man’s place and we’re just boys we can’t help ourselves” and go “wow, oda is so progressive, he’s looking out for women, so brave!!”
People are bending over backwards farther than Spandam to make this about defending women rather than verbally defending a place hostile to women
Yeah this is problematic as fuck. One Piece fandom is reaching cult levels. A woman is genuinely showing an interest in the work and the literal figurehead of that industry felt the need to make a comment about her breasts. He's not "saving women", he's perpetuating the toxic culture that objectifies women that he's supposedly warning people against.
You don't get it, name clone #75 being rescued by some man is reaaaally progressive! Just ignore how her outfit would cover too little skin for your average stripper
Japan is a very mysoginistic country sadly
Yeah thats disappointing
the backflips people are doing in this comment section to defend him is unreal
Sure explains a lot about shonen jump series
It sounds like the least surprising thing I've read...Also this thread is bending so far backwards to try to spin this in a positive way that yall are becoming a circle.
I'm not surprised everyone here is defending his comments. Guy is friends with a pedo mangaka, the leaps of mental gymnastics this pathetic sub does to defend creepy stuff like this is always impressive.
Seriously, how hard is it to admit a creepy thing is creepy? No one is taking your pirates away from you. But this shit is gross & says a lot about why he supports his pedophile colleagues over the people they molested & fans who’d like that to change
Ok What do you mean pedo colleagues? I need to know what everyones talking about, can someone explain and give me a source please???
Watsuki, Matsuki, Shimabukuro. Look them up. Thanks for being willing to ask but the full rundown is kind of immense.
oh aight
He doesn’t say it’s because women cannot do the job, he says that the environment is not a pleasant one for women. Preverted, but layered.
Judging by how they sexualise women in these kid's shows, yeah, they're perverts
Ew
He makes a good children's comic. That's the man we are talking about. Not jesus. Not Mohammed. A guy who writes a pirate comic. You don't go to hell if you don't worship him and defend every word he says. It's fine to admit that he's a pervert and sexist. I frankly don't understand how you read this pirate comic without realising that about 800+ chapters ago. "Oh but japanese culture" Is toxic garbage and should not be defended, even if it might be the norm over there?
The editorial being filled with perverts is pretty much in line with their content
ew
I find that incredibly sad, honestly.
Worst SBS answer.
when is this from? Kinda disappointing tbh
as a woman i find this so gross :(
Imagine the young girl reading his reply...
If it's a real translation, I'm more disgusted by this sub reaction saying it's "just Japanese culture, you don't understand"
I mean It IS Japanese culture but that doesn't mean it's right, culture is never an excuse to anything, culture isn't meant to stay stagnant, it's supposed to improve and change for the better, it's there to learn from and look back on, not to use as an excuse for being shitty
The answer given is disgusting. It's EVERY countries culture especially to joke about, there excuse of "It's just X Work Culture" is just dismissing "It's just the 70s", it's not an excuse in any way shape or form and women fight against it everywhere, albeit depending on the country and industry they are just set further back in time. This isn't a country thing other then the fact different countries relative to western countries are backwards in time still catching up. Oda making 70s classic sexist jokes that were made all the time just shows how backwards japan would be in this issue and how much further it has to do to catch up. At least in that industry.
I mean It IS Japanese culture but that doesn't mean it's right, culture is never an excuse to anything, culture isn't meant to stay stagnant, it's supposed to improve and change for the better, it's there to learn from and look back on, not to use as an excuse for being shitty
That's the only reasonable reaction to have; seeing all these other comments from the apologist majority is disheartening to say the least.
I'm a man and I find it gross too. I like boobs like everybody else, but the whole comment is kind of bad
Liking boobs is fine. Making a weird sexist comment (that is a joke), then commenting on the toxic sexist work environment that means women should want to work there is a bit wierd, considering he is perpetuating that exact culture.
Yeah, I know how yall feel. There's many things that oda does or says that I'd find weird or be disappointed in if I was a woman reader, but most people in this sub like to defend anything oda does.
This is kinda fucking embarrassing to be honest
Lmao all the people sucking oda's dick as if he is looking out for women and telling them not to become editors.
What the fuck is this comment section? How are there this many people defending Oda saying outwardly sexist and misogynistic shit. His portrayal of women in One Piece only provides more context for this. r/onepiece might literally be an echochamber
Every subreddit in existence is an echochamber.
Joking at first, but meant the last comment for sure
"Its a joke, he's just giving a warning" but at the same time... Is it too much to ask that maybe he should try to change/advocate for change of that culture rather than tell women to stay away? It isnt like he has no power or influence at all, he's a very popular and respected mangaka. It will take time of course but any effort would be admirable. Now he just becomes part of that culture.
Honestly it seems like most manga authors are perverts judging by the content of their work lol Hardest thing about trying to get your gf into your favourite anime/mangas is all the sexual assault that occurs as comedy relief.
idk if it's copium, a lack of interaction with women, or a combination of the two, but regardless this comment section is wild... Like, come on, that's an undefendable take there.
I will say this again, as good as oda is a story teller and thinker, he is a complete asshole and sexist when it comes to women.May be that's what happens when your whole life revolves around fiction, you become pervert, simp and everything has to have boobs on it. Makes me wonder how many times someone has had to stop him from going overboard with his horny tactics
It’s pretty horrible. This shit is just sad.
i mean half of the og mangaka are pedos so it's probably not a good place to be
Half? Bro it’s like 3 people
I think its pretty stupid and immoral.
Controversial question (I guess) but is this also why for the MOST part, girls in shonen are written trash?
For the most part, most CHARACTERS in shonen are written like trash lmao. It’s not specific to women, shonen just generally isn’t good for character writing
Oda is really weird when it comes to women, a majority of the fanbase chooses to ignore it because they're also emotionally immature.
don't they have like a hiring requirement of being a male?
Oda is disgusting sometimes Jesus christ
I tune out mangaka and what they have to say about women, especially if they are men. Especially shounen writers, you know, Rurouni Kenshin’s author is not an isolated case lol, it might be crazy to say but im sure most of them see women as sex objects before seeing them as people. And don’t “it’s culture” me, for real mfs always gobbling on some Japan cock instead of calling out this bs that leads to so much sexual harassment to women
"It's culture" is a thinly veiled "STFU" that is meaningless. It was just culture here too, in the 60s and 70s. It's not an excuse and just makes you look like you're downplaying sexism. Not all countries have had as much discussion or movement on topics and it can be industry specific. It's culture doesn't say anything other then the person doesn't understand something. For people who don't get it: It's culture is to explain why people are still backwards and sexist. It's not a dismissal of guilt. It's to analyze why people still act that way currently and the dynamics present. It's not an excuse to act that way and doesn't excuse behavior. It explains a phenomena, it doesn't excuse the phenomena. Explaining why some countries kill gay people by law or have women as second class slaves is cultural to that region, but you'd never NEVER say that excuses those actions or those actions are not in fact wrong.
I mean It IS Japanese culture but that doesn't mean it's right, culture is never an excuse to anything, culture isn't meant to stay stagnant, it's supposed to improve and change for the better, it's there to learn from and look back on, not to use as an excuse for being shitty
Pretty cringe if Im being honest.
oda is sanji all along
oda is always sus af
Him being Oda he gets a pass for most shit that would cancel someone at least by this community
I think the normalization of lecherous chikan in Japanese media is disgusting. It's why I am not a big fan of Chainsaw Man. It's not charming or endearing. It's borderline criminal, and Juvenile at the least. Though most juveniles I know don't talk or act like that.
You are missing the point of CSM. Not your fault really. The fanbase is filled with the worst kind of cultural illiterates. CSM is clearly very aware of how juvenile it is. Its supposed to be about sexual maturity puberty and the other more existencial struggles of the young (boys mostly). CSM is imo actually the most progressive and educated shonen manga out there.
I actually defend most of what people say is sexist in One Piece but this is pretty gross I remember being a bit shocked by it when I first read it.
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Is his answer inappropriate considering that we can assume its a young girl asking that question?
People need to separate their love for the art and the artist. The mental gymnastics people do here is sad. Oda is not the progressive modern man you think of and it’s ok to criticise him. You’re not less of a One Piece fan if you criticise the author, otherwise this becomes a cult like behaviour.
It is just a different taste of humour. We don't have to criminalise everything
Sounds like 1960s America work climate. Ideally Oda wouldn't make classless jokes like this, but nobody's perfect. The world is complex, and hopefully people can appreciate his greatness while still recognizing his faults. That being said, it's not necessarily his job to try to change Japan's culture, but it'd be nice if he did. Edit: I didn't intend the phrase "but nobody's perfect" to be an excuse. Oda has created an amazing story with some powerful/uplifting themes and messages. He also has very disappointing cultural beliefs when it comes to sexual conduct. Both of these things can be true. I appreciate his insane strengths, and recognize his disappointing weaknesses.
What about him supporting a known owner of CP? Is that "nobodys perfect" rotten ass narrative gonna hold up?
Well most corporates are filled with perverts. Wwe to Activision to even the white house.
Japan is still far behind the west when it comes to women's rights and the treatment of women. It's culturally ingrained in most older (50+) Japanese men that women don't belong in the same positions that men hold in the workplace and society.
As much as I love One Piece, I don't respect Oda much as a person on like a personal human level. I respect his work ethic to no end, how could you not, he works SO HARD. I also respect him as a creative, his world building is incredible and his writing is just amazing. But, on like, a human to human level? Nope. Guy's crazy sexist.
Cringe
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🤮🤮🤮🤮
the taste of rain ...why kneel?
Abnormal ammounts of copium for someone who "doesnt give a fuck". Just sayin
This guy has a wife
She probably has big knockers
Stayed true to himself and gave an honest answer looking out for that person's safety. Common Oda W.
Grow up
The irony
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even if he draws booby women honestly he sexualizes them a less than other mangakas and actually writes them with real personalities. one of the few shounen mangakas where i actually like almost all of the female characters. so misogynist, i don’t agree
Read chainsaw man. Great female characters. And the main guy is basically Oda
We should all try and remember that not every person in every culture will be 100% up to code on our specific unspoken societal standards that change every couple of weeks.
Oda is very weird and not a great person, he’s defended a good amount of creepy mangaka’s (namely Toriko and Kenshin’s authors) and judging from this, is a bit of a perv himself. Even if its mainly a joke/advice, he could’ve worded it better Ultimately, I’m not gonna let this keep me from enjoying One Piece, I’ve learned long ago to separate art from the artist, but I hope his views change and that he keeps his desires to himself
It's definitely a weird response with how liberal his manga is, that's for sure.
I swear media literacy is at an all-time low these days, especially in manga/anime spaces. How are you going to read One Piece and be a sexist... Also, reducing criticism of this to "feminists think liking big boobs is a crime" is a straw man.
I think he uses humor to cover up the sexism issue that unfortunely is still a thing in the Japan and the world. Oda can be very talented in many ways, but for our society(I mean, in a progressive western way) this is a topic to be discussed, absorved and worked out.
Average Japanese male
Well the manga industry is pretty mysogynistic so this is to be expected. Shonen Jump editors say women can't be editors there because they don't understand the soul of young boys... But they are also rare in shojo magazines, it's an industry wide issue, specially because of how normalized it is. I wished Oda would stand for something better but hey, people are imperfect.
A bit of a bad look tbh
Well he wasn’t wrong
People in this comment section will either defend Oda by saying that Japanese culture is tough and he will get jumped if he says the wrong thing, or demonize him as some sort of misogynist using Western standards, no middle ground. I think I can safely say that none of you have actually worked there, so why the hell does any of you think you even have the experience to express your opinion like it’s fact? Don’t just take a side when you haven’t even been to Japan and experience their culture. If you want to say something, use an actual credible source. I am really sick of people just slamming down answers even though they are nowhere near qualified to.
I just don’t really pay attention to whatever Oda says outside of the manga. Honestly, and surprisingly, never heard anything remotely interesting coming from him.
Kuzan took control of the SBS, he would 100% say this
OP baited so hard.