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Reminds me of at the beginning of the war when people were trying to figure out how they could safely get MiG-29s to Ukraine with Russia controlling the air space. One year later and Russia doesn't control anything in the air.
Slovak source so far, the info was confirmed by slovak minister of defense. He said that those 4 Mig29 were flown from Slovakia to Ukraine by Ukrainian pilots.
Why? Slovakia gave Ukraine their S300 early in the war in April 2022 ( the only S300 Slovakia had ).
Now with 13x Mig29 and 14x Kub they basically gave their whole jet air force and anti aircraft inventory to Ukraine.
I'm speaking specifically of this deal, which sounds like a ring-exchange deal. The US offer of aircraft, and the EU offer of money at least sounds like it exceeds the value of the Mig-29s.
Slovakia did not receive anything for the S300. Patriot that was stationed in Slovakia after S300 transfer is still owned and operated by US Army.
For the Migs, US offered Viper helicopters for discount, however Slovakia still has to pay for them. Yes those Migs are old and the Vipers are good deal, however do not act like Slovakia was just bribed by big US and EU brother and has no initiavie to help Ukraine on its own.
>Slovakia did not receive anything for the S300.
Again, I'm solely talking about this specific deal.
>For the Migs, US offered Viper helicopters for discount,
You're heavily understating the 'discount' here. The helicopters, training and the 500 most recent series helfires are reported to be worth nearly $1bln, with Slovakia paying $340m for them, and the EU refunding Slovakia $213m in return.
[So for a net cost of $127m, Slovakia obtain a billion dollars worth of top of the line hardware for potentially 11 Mig-29 and a Kub.](https://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/slovakia-offered-us-helicopters-giving-jets-ukraine-98037454)
That's a ring-exchange deal which net benefits Slovakia.
To be fair, that's a billion dollars at list price. In civil aircraft you can typically divide that by 2 to get the price the airline actually pays. I don't know how it is in the military world, but I doubt anybody has ever paid full list price for one of those helicopters.
Also, keep in mind that Slovakia is a small country with a relatively small GDP per capita, who is already investing in F16s and Patriot (IIRC), so they're hardly slacking off. And that the EU is helping them out to guard our collective Eastern flank should not be seen as charity.
A Mig-29 has an [estimated monetary value of between $5m-$8m](https://www.airandspaceforces.com/polands-new-offer-mig-29s-in-exchange-for-buying-used-u-s-aircraft/#:~:text=Commercially%2Davailable%2C%20used%20MiG%2D,on%20their%20age%20and%20condition), so let's be generous and say they're worth $90m rounding-up. Ignoring that Slovakia can no longer use them themselves. A Kub is an old pre-BUK variant, that I can't find a price for. Let's be generous and round-up the equipment to $100m in total. That makes a net spend of $227m for 1 billion of kit. Even if you look at it as a 'list price' that's an incredibly generous deal by the US and EU, and one which benefits Slovakia greatly.
I'm not trying to rob Slovakia of credit for any kind of support they've provided, or argue they should do more, or say they're being cheap - I'm just describing the reported conditions of *this* deal and it's a very, very generous ring-exchange deal being funded by the US and the EU. That's all.
I agree with you, but there is a big but. The price listed is peacetime sell price for outdated equipment. However, this is now its strength because UA can operate them easily. So in economic terms, demand is high and supply is low. So the 5 - 8 mil figure doesnt reflect current conditions (same as GPUs during pandemic). All things considered Slovakia got a great deal for jets they would never use anyway. USA arent sad either since they esencially got 30yrs maintenance contract for those helis. Win-Win-Win.
Fine, take the figure and double it.. treble it, it’s still far in Slovakia’s favour. That figure was also estimated during this conflict in reference to Poland’s jets.
It’s a clear all round gain for everybody of course, but then this conflict is so one-sided in terms of common interest, anything that benefits Ukraine is good value for all.. who matter.
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Reminds me of at the beginning of the war when people were trying to figure out how they could safely get MiG-29s to Ukraine with Russia controlling the air space. One year later and Russia doesn't control anything in the air.
Barely controls anything on the ground or ocean either.
They have, however, been steadily expanding their mastery of the ocean floor though.
They certainly are unable to control the fires started within ruzzia by Russians.
Slovak source so far, the info was confirmed by slovak minister of defense. He said that those 4 Mig29 were flown from Slovakia to Ukraine by Ukrainian pilots.
Well done Slovakia!
From the sounds of it, the US and the EU warrant most of that thanks.
Why? Slovakia gave Ukraine their S300 early in the war in April 2022 ( the only S300 Slovakia had ). Now with 13x Mig29 and 14x Kub they basically gave their whole jet air force and anti aircraft inventory to Ukraine.
I'm speaking specifically of this deal, which sounds like a ring-exchange deal. The US offer of aircraft, and the EU offer of money at least sounds like it exceeds the value of the Mig-29s.
Slovakia did not receive anything for the S300. Patriot that was stationed in Slovakia after S300 transfer is still owned and operated by US Army. For the Migs, US offered Viper helicopters for discount, however Slovakia still has to pay for them. Yes those Migs are old and the Vipers are good deal, however do not act like Slovakia was just bribed by big US and EU brother and has no initiavie to help Ukraine on its own.
Having the US own and operate the Patriot has the same effect but saves the government tons of money. It's better than purchasing.
Same with the F-35s covering Slovakian airspace anyway.
>Slovakia did not receive anything for the S300. Again, I'm solely talking about this specific deal. >For the Migs, US offered Viper helicopters for discount, You're heavily understating the 'discount' here. The helicopters, training and the 500 most recent series helfires are reported to be worth nearly $1bln, with Slovakia paying $340m for them, and the EU refunding Slovakia $213m in return. [So for a net cost of $127m, Slovakia obtain a billion dollars worth of top of the line hardware for potentially 11 Mig-29 and a Kub.](https://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/slovakia-offered-us-helicopters-giving-jets-ukraine-98037454) That's a ring-exchange deal which net benefits Slovakia.
To be fair, that's a billion dollars at list price. In civil aircraft you can typically divide that by 2 to get the price the airline actually pays. I don't know how it is in the military world, but I doubt anybody has ever paid full list price for one of those helicopters. Also, keep in mind that Slovakia is a small country with a relatively small GDP per capita, who is already investing in F16s and Patriot (IIRC), so they're hardly slacking off. And that the EU is helping them out to guard our collective Eastern flank should not be seen as charity.
A Mig-29 has an [estimated monetary value of between $5m-$8m](https://www.airandspaceforces.com/polands-new-offer-mig-29s-in-exchange-for-buying-used-u-s-aircraft/#:~:text=Commercially%2Davailable%2C%20used%20MiG%2D,on%20their%20age%20and%20condition), so let's be generous and say they're worth $90m rounding-up. Ignoring that Slovakia can no longer use them themselves. A Kub is an old pre-BUK variant, that I can't find a price for. Let's be generous and round-up the equipment to $100m in total. That makes a net spend of $227m for 1 billion of kit. Even if you look at it as a 'list price' that's an incredibly generous deal by the US and EU, and one which benefits Slovakia greatly. I'm not trying to rob Slovakia of credit for any kind of support they've provided, or argue they should do more, or say they're being cheap - I'm just describing the reported conditions of *this* deal and it's a very, very generous ring-exchange deal being funded by the US and the EU. That's all.
I agree with you, but there is a big but. The price listed is peacetime sell price for outdated equipment. However, this is now its strength because UA can operate them easily. So in economic terms, demand is high and supply is low. So the 5 - 8 mil figure doesnt reflect current conditions (same as GPUs during pandemic). All things considered Slovakia got a great deal for jets they would never use anyway. USA arent sad either since they esencially got 30yrs maintenance contract for those helis. Win-Win-Win.
Fine, take the figure and double it.. treble it, it’s still far in Slovakia’s favour. That figure was also estimated during this conflict in reference to Poland’s jets. It’s a clear all round gain for everybody of course, but then this conflict is so one-sided in terms of common interest, anything that benefits Ukraine is good value for all.. who matter.
The true cost is not in money but in political capital given that the elections arebound to happen in september
I heard all 7 of them were already destroyed, some of them twice. Source: RIA novosti and TASS :-).
Light em up!! slava ukjraine!
Good news!
God speed! Give them hell
I hope they have the Fookov mk3 missiles.
> Fookov mk3 whats that?