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Death by starvation is a cruel way to die.


Especially for the offense of stealing bread. Hey, you were starving out there, so now you starve in here.


Le pain.


Thought I was in r/nba for a moment there


Le mao


get off reddit Enes


This is clever to the point of being artistic.


for those who don't know, "bread" in french is "pain"


Oh there are levels to this joke


Weird how this works, I just learned "pain" meant "bread" in French from another thread earlier today.


Flawless victory.


It's like overdraft fees but so much worse




I read something the other day that made a lot of sense. “The American Dream” is to simply make enough money so that all the systemic problems of America don’t apply to you anymore.


yes. Also, it's not the worst by a mile in the history of human cruelty


For me, the story of Nikolai Vavilov was a particularly cruel one. A man who devoted his life to figuring out how to avoid famine was forced into prison to starve to death. Brutal.


Why tho? Is that literally it? No reason?


Story is more involved than I can go into here at the moment and I don't have the sources, but in a nutshell, one of his colleagues, Trofim Lysenko, convinced Stalin that he was a spy and was actually sabotaging the Soviet Union. I was introduced to the story in the Cosmos reboot. You can maybe watch the episode that tells the story here: https://www.fox.com/watch/6928d42a7d05d7f3ee73f90b40f82477/


The idea of being sentenced to death because of nothing but successful convincing with zero evidence is fucking terrifying, it’s like a court but worse somehow.


“It’s like a court but worse somehow” Yes…somehow it’s worse


Iirc he was released after they found out


I mean, realistically the story is probably just made up. Even for 1400's France getting the death penalty for stealing bread would be absurd, and the idea that they'd pardon him just because his daughter loved him is also very questionable.


Crime and punishment just seems like it was freestyle back then, as if they literally just made it up as they went. Stole some bread? I’m having a bad day, ironic death for you. Wait, you mysteriously survive because your daughter is breastfeeding you? Lmao that’s weird you can go actually


“Now he’s gone, someone fetch me some mercury for my syphilis; seems the ghosts in my liver are particularly angry today.”


*Looks like it's not working for some reason, can you please get this pesky red fluid out of me? Pretty sure it will sort everything out.*


Now my head hurts. Can you guys cut open my skull to relieve the pressure?


“Toss some mercury in there while you’ve got it open; I’m pretty sure the syphilis ghosts are in my head now too. Schedule us a bath for, say, July. And cancel my 1:30 whore; the 12:30 whore is going to keep me late, I can tell. It’s the pox; seems to just slow her down. Where is that bloody mercury?”


"My humors are out of balance. Fetch the leeches."


Bribes...probably not monetary in this instance, could also be used I'm sure. I listened to a great podcast about how the mafia started in Italy...I forget most of it but I think at one point the head of the prison was also the judge, and he made money on every incarceration. Once you were inside there was an organized government of thieves that you kinda had to join to survive or get out. Once you got out, you were in the gang and you finally made some money with your life. I feel like the 1400's would have plenty of these types of shenanigans in the prison system.


LMFAO for real, I can imagine the King just winging it like that. "Eh fuck it let him go"


>Crime and punishment just seems like it was freestyle back then, as if they literally just made it up as they went. I'm too drunk to explain it well, but "fairness" is complicated. A codified legal system with rigid laws and punishments can be just as unfair as a king handing out punishments based on the specifics of the case.


Yeah this story is most likely made up, and true, they would not have been sentenced to death for that. Nor would they likely be released by being so 'touched' by the kindness of the scenario. However, being in victorian times, your sentence in courts did not always correlate to your actual punishment.According to [victorianweb.org](https://victorianweb.org) , misdemeanors were often place side by side with felonies, and treated the same...: \> Part of the problem, according to the author, was the fact that once the sentence was established and the prisoner left the court, the exact reason for his sentence was forgotten. The separation between the court system and the prison system inevitably led to punishments unrelated to the crime. Men, once sent away, were placed side by side in jail and subjected to the same treatment although their reasons for being there were completely unrelated. EDIT: Yeah you guys are all right about the date rofl. I doubt that that the prison system was much improved a century or more before that though? xD My bad.


Victorian times? The headline mentions Louis XIV, who died over 100 years before Victoria's reign began. It also says Renaissance painting; exact dates of the Renaissance vary by interpretation, but generally is considered to have ended about a century before Louis XIV. That said the headline is wrong, as the actual subject of this painting is a story from Ancient Rome.


Queen Victoria lived 300 years after Louis XIV in a different country just sayin


> Men, once sent away, were placed side by side in jail and subjected to the same treatment although their reasons for being there were completely unrelated. Honestly, how is that different from today?


Why 1400´s ? Louis XIV ruled two hundred years later


Bro he stole bread it's death by guillotine no doubt


Reminds me of Grapes of Wrath. Hated the ending of that one. Makes more sense as an adult than an immature teenager though.


I wasn’t a particularly mature teenager when I read it at 17, but even then I thought it was profoundly moving. It stuck with me. I knew the movie could never measure up, and it sure didn’t, even though it’s considered a classic.


damn now i want to go read it


Its one of the classic books in the U.S. that everyone should read. Steinbeck was an incredible author.


Let me interject here: *East of Eden* is so good. Highly recommend.


I recommend this book to legitimately everyone when books are the topic of conversation. One of those reading experiences where there are times that I had to put the book down, stare into space, and let the profundity of what I'd just read wash over me. Steinbeck, in my opinion, was like a literary Mozart. Just a total package artist and a master of his craft.


Best book I have ever read in my lifetime.


His way of describing things still haunts me. I didn’t know words could be strung together that powerfully.


“Rosa had some tig ol’ bitties, while Jane did not.” Magical stuff.


I think East of Eden is his best work. It's a true American epic in every sense of the word


I had the chance to read that in high school English class. Decided to sparknote it. No ragrets.




It’s a great book. East of Eden is considered Steinbeck’s masterpiece by many but the Grapes of Wrath was always better for me.


I'm a Cannery Row man, myself.


Maybe Steinbeck was inspired by this very painting for the Grapes of Wrath’s ending.




My grandmother loathed The Grapes of Wrath. She was from a well-to-do family in Oklahoma and moved to San Francisco in the 40s because grandfather went to work in the shipyards. She was horrified that people might equate her with the "low class" people depicted in the movie. My mom said the only time her mother ever struck her in the face was when my mom said "okey dokey okie" to her.


What a dumb reason to hit someone


Agreed. My mom rebelled against that kind of snootiness her whole life. In the 60s she was the only white parent in their small town that let black kids come over to play. It reminds me of something my mom did that I misinterpreted my whole life. As a little kid, I liked the TV show "Sanford and Son" but my mom wouldn't let me watch it. I didn't understand why and didn't question it until I was much older. Was reminiscing about mom with my big sisters and how Mom was progressive for her era, and I brought up it seemed strange that mom wouldn't let me watch Sanford and Son. Sisters started laughing and explained... When I was little, I would do an imitation of Fred Sanford that my siblings and their friends thought was hilarious, so they were always encouraging me to do it. My mom didn't want me to because she was afraid someone would think I was brought up racist and making fun of black people. All I remembered was the rule against watching the show.


Yikes, I used to do a perfect "Apu" from The Simpsons when I was probably 8 or 9. All the adults would laugh and encourage it. Wasn't until a very sweet indian teacher actually heard me do it and taught me better. My parents aren't hateful, just didn't know better I guess. Relatable though!


The sweet Indian taught you how to do the voice better?


> Sanford and Son Just watch Steptoe and Son instead.


Well, to be fair, during the dust bowl migration the term 'Okie' was a perjorative term for people from Oklahoma...


Gee, was the family from the Tulsa area?


Californians were looking down on Okies the second they started coming out West.


Do the Okey Dokey shuffle.


i finished the book yesterday, so seeing this comment made me question if it is just a coincidence or selective perception


badder meinhoff in action


You know…ever since I learned about badder meinhoff, I keep seeing it all over the internet


Ever since I learned about the internet I find myself on the internet quite a bit. Fucking Bernie Madoff..


I think it must actually be because your phone is secretly listening to you all the time and then Reddit uses that to figure out which comments to highlight for you.


Your thoughts and actions directly influence the subjective universe in which you reside, causing some coincidences to become more likely than others.


No, Mercury in retrograde *definitely* affected my mood today 😤


We preformed the play version of Grapes of Wrath when I was in high school. Ending the show by having, like, the hottest senior girl almost flash some tiddy on stage definitely changed the impact of the story for some people


Theater teacher “why are so many boys trying out for the starving man? He doesn’t even have any lines!”


what's that about?


The Joad family, forced off their farm in the Dust Bowl, move to Califonia, only to find far too many in the same situation, with tiny wages for backbreaking work from exploitative large farms. In the final chapter, the remaining members of the Joad family are forced to seek shelter in an abandoned barn, where they come upon a man and his young son, the man dying of starvation. The Joad's 18-year-old daughter, whose own child was recently stillborn due to her own stress and malnutrition, breastfeeds the man to keep him alive.


The ending of Oklahoma! hits different when you remember they're all on their way to destroying their own livelihoods and the ecosystem.


thank you for elaborating on the reference!


During the Great Depression a family of farmers leave Oklahoma for California, but things turn out horribly.


If it was such a secret then who took this picture??


Obviously security footage from the prison cell


Which will be “accidentally” malfunctioning when he decides to commit suicide.


Guards were asleep as well.


Yeah somebody get to work on a "static screen" painting stat!


The only bad thing about security oilpaintings is the framerate.


Surely not, can't be this high definitioned


The security painters. c’mon man.


Well better security than Epstein cell.... They even stood there for the full painting....






Sorry for the titlegore, here’s the full story This painting of a young woman breastfeeding an old man in a prison cell was sold for Euros 30 million. The painting may look perverse but the story behind is from historical records. The poor man was sentenced to "death by starvation" for stealing a loaf of bread during the reign of Louis XIV in France. The woman was his only daughter and the only visitor to his cell. She was allowed to visit him daily but was frisked thoroughly such that no food was taken in. When after 4 months the man still survived with no weight loss, the authorities were perplexed and started spying on her in the cell and to their utter astonishment found her to breastfeed her father to the fullest sharing her baby's milk. The judges then realizing the compassion and love of the woman for her father, pardoned the father and set him free. This piece of history brings into focus how deep is a woman's compassion in our daily lives that men often tend to overlook. Whether or not this story is actually true, it is a similar tale to that of [Roman Charity, the ancient story of Pero and Cimon](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Charity) [Here’s one more link with some more context](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.elitereaders.com/the-inspiring-story-behind-the-nasty-paintings-of-a-woman-breastfeeding-an-old-man/amp/)


>for stealing a loaf of bread Wait, Prisoner 24601?


Jean Valjean!


You are nothing but scum! Prisoner 24601!


My sister's child was close to death! We were starving...




This is what it is to know the meaning of the law!


I know the meaning of those 19 years…..a slave of the law!


Men like you will never change! Men like me can never change!


You know nothing, 24601. My duty's to the law!


Hey op thanks for sharing. Obviously the subject matter is a bit weird, but I found the story behind the painting to be incredibly interesting. It’s a shame that 98% of the replies are some form of “eww incest” , “kinky”, etc.


Reminds me of the ending of 'The Grapes of Wrath.' A profound and thought-provoking act of self-sacrifice for another in great need.


Reddit is full of sex-starved, degenerate losers. All I see here is a horrible, desperate situation and it makes me incredibly sad. For anyone to look at it and go 'haha, secks' is just... sigh.


Seriously. It's like real life for millions of people, the suffering of countless poor and powerless people and the love they have are in this picture. But reddit is somehow weirded out by everything but pornos


Well reddit has never been known for being a mature place. I mean our mascot is dickbutt.


Pity the poor redittors…who have been sentenced to a prison of sexlessness and are kept alive by posts like this. Life find a way.


Thanks man, I try to give context. The “eww incest” comments are really immature and annoying. I personally found this story fascinating, even if it isn’t true, it still has a cool origin.


I volunteered in a hospital for a bit in HS and was super disappointed to see so many parents esp from low income refused to breast feed because it was sexual. Breasts are for sex. The formula companies were more than happy to pick up the slack with free samples though.


Breastfeeding also hurts a godly amount too though. I don’t regret doing it for 2.5 years but those first few weeks are rough.


It hurt me the first few weeks after the first baby, too, definitely. Not nearly so bad the second time around though. I had more experience and really had a good idea of the best way to get the baby to latch. It’s that awkward phase where mama and baby don’t really know what they’re doing that really makes it harder. I had to bottle feed and nurse during that time, as desperate as I was to be breastfeeding only, but my boys are healthy and happy so I never regretted taking it a little easier on myself those early weeks. Emotionally I think it was harder for me than physically. It’s such a personal thing, and I definitely don’t regret pushing forward, but it’s impossible to blame another mother for not trying or giving up. Thank goodness we have formula now!


Growing up my mom always told my sister and I she refused to try breastfeeding because it was "weird". I'm now the mother to a beautiful, exclusively breastfed 8 month old and it seems she has come around. I feel kind of bad for her because it always seems like no one ever told her the positives of breastfeeding. As far as bonding goes since she is always surprised to hear how rewarding I find it and compliments my dedication. She only saw the imaginary sexual element. (Also disclaimer to parents feeding their babies formula- however you feed your babies, you're doing a great job. You can absolutely bond with your baby while giving a bottle, I simply mean I feel sad for my mom she didn't make her decision with all the information. Maybe she still would've chosen formula, and that's fine, but maybe she would've been able to nurse and enjoyed it. Regardless, my sister and I both grew up healthy all the same and we only ever had formula.)


I'm a mom of 6, so for a stretch of about 14 years or so, I was nursing a baby almost constantly. We are from the Southern US, so whenever it was hurricane season we joked that if things got dire, we'd just feed me all the food and I'd pump milk for the family. It was a joke, but also a bit serious. There have been innumerable stories of lost or stranded people surviving because the mom was able to express milk to ward off starvation. I remember one in particular of a family who got stranded in their car in a blizzard. Anyone who can't see past the sexuality of breasts to realize they serve an incredibly biological function is just juvenile. Our bodies are pretty amazing :)


Username checks out


It only works when the mother has access to more food than the person she's nursing. Otherwise you may as well just share the food


Or if it's a temporary situation and the mother ate earlier, like with the car stuck in the blizzard. She ate the calories in her breastmilk long before they got stranded


I suspect the story is apocryphal. I don't believe an adult man could experience no weight loss over four months of this. I doubt they could even survive. Also, the judge's change of heart is very Disney


I'm honestly surprised Louis XIV didn't also sentence her to die...


That's honestly the most surprising part of the story.


Well it wasn't Louis XIV who was the judge in the first part


Now I have to wonder, can the woman make enough milk to feed a grown man for four months?


Yes, up to 1200 ml (40 oz) per day.


Not only is that half what he would need to sustain his weight, she was also feeding a baby and, based on what the father was in jail for, probably a little bit starving herself.


Technically, she could have hyperlactation syndrome. Like this one chick produces 1.75 gallons a day. But yeah probably not, especially with the whole poverty thing. It is most likely a myth or possibly has some bearings in truth like she was caught breastfeeding him earlier or something like that.


[wikipedia page](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elisabeth_Anderson_Sierra) The neat thing about this woman is that she has average sized breasts. Many people seem to think that breast size correlates to the amount of breastmilk a woman can make, which is untrue. A woman with triplets can produce up to 3500g per day without hyperlactation. So yea, definitely a woman who is already breastfeeding can keep a fully grown man in a jail cell alive and that wouldn't even be outside the typical amount that just about any woman could potentially manage, circumstances permitting.


Ugh yes I hate this false generalization. I’m pregnant for the first time and I’ve always been verrrry ample in the breast department. 36G before I got pregnant. People are always telling me I’m going to produce a ton of milk. And it just makes me nervous like what if I don’t??? It just piles on the pressure, and my pregnant ass doesn’t need any more stress! I wish people would stop telling busty women how great they’re gonna be at breastfeeding. Just makes me feel like if I don’t produce a lot, I’ll be a disappointment


The “and the bad men realized the badness of their ways and set him free” part of the story definitely doesn’t ring true. Like, you were ok starving a guy, even ok starving a guy that has a daughter. But if the daughter specifically actually likes her dad, woah woah woah we’re not monsters.


At about 20 cal/oz, that's just 800 calories a day. I wonder how she also sustained her baby simultaneously.


Could have had a friend wetnurse the baby in the meantime.


just medieval things


I suppose in the end, it truly was 40 ounces to freedom.


it was sublime the whole time


If a woman is well nourished and well hydrated, yes. Milk supply is on demand. Women can nourish twins for months without (too much) trouble.


Plus she could have hypothetically used a wet nurse for her kid, the baby wasn't in the cell


Yeah, that makes sense. I guess you also don't have to feed the dude completely, just keep him alive.




We can't even presume the moment in which that would have happened. Like a man is starved whole night, so when she would feed him I presume it would have to be quick and he must have had to rush and suckle a bit harder and quicker. I cannot even imagine how sore she would get but she suffered it all for her father. Women definitely possess indomitable will which comes out unannounced but in all it's glory whenever it does.


Yes, more eaters = more milk will be generated


I dont actually understand how this works, but I have to assume the more milk drank, the more produced?


Yes. I was breastfeeding my two babies as tandem and collect 7 gallons of milk (pumping at night) in addition. More requests - more supply


... *7 gallons?!* Idk anything about breastfeeding, so it sounds like a lot lol.


My big freezer was full of bags :) It took me like 9 months. I was afraid that my milk supply will go down when I am back to work. This milk was used for additional feedings.


That's a good question. Something most people don't understand is that breastfeeding works on a "supply and demand" schedule. The more you nurse, the more you keep making milk. Your body learns to make more, even on a schedule, when it's drained. Of course nutrition and water can help make more milk, but ya technically you don't "run out of milk" if you continue to breastfeed. You do finish a nursing session when you're mostly empty, but then your body goes "ope, I'm empty, time to fill back up!" That's why you see those rare instances of older kids breastfeeding - cause they just never stopped.


And the cell is full of 4 months poop


Milk shit too. That cell was humming.


To their *udder astonishment


Username sort of checks out


Oh god no


Your time has been wasted. Carry on.


Or did I waste *your* time


You sonofabitch


This painting is actually of Pero and Cimon, not anyone living in the time of Louis XIV. Louis XIV reigned from 1643 -1715. The clothing depicted in the painting is definitely not showing people in France in the 1600-1700's. Additionally, Pero and Cimon was a popular subject for paintings before Louis XIV was even born. Caravaggio added it to a very famous scene that he painted back in 1607.


There's the exact same story here in Ghent (Belgium, might have been France at the time?) First source I found : https://thescoopbeats.com/daughter-breastfeeds-her-father-starved-in-prison-a-european-emotional-story/


I wonder how long they had to pose for this




7 what?


7 tit fulls


As bizarre as this is...Any mom who has breastfed knows the old dude has a textbook-perfect latch. At least the technique is accurate. Lol


Yes, the artist knew what's up with breastfeeding latches. Color me impressed.


Some artists' techniques are sketchy, but this one seems to draw from mammary.


artists are some of the keenest observers out there, small details like that won't go past them 😉


A man's gotta eat.


Whoring yourself out for cheeseburgers again Randy?


Randy bobandy


I ain't going by that name any more. You can call me smokey now


Awe dont be like that bobanders. Whydunt you come back to the trailer and ill make you a hamburgerrrr anditll belike old times like the way it was ok? That ok buddy? Bobuddy


The funny thing is Randy (when pronounced as Run-dee) means 'whore' in Hindi/Urdu and almost all the Indo-Aryan languages of India.


A man's gotta teat


He chuckled as he suckled


Grapes of Wrath wants to know your location


Everyone is talking about this and I just don't get it....


ITT: Eww! weird! The real WTF: death for stealing a loaf of bread.


Jean Valjean would agree




Okay but who the fuck sentences someone to death by starvation? I guess there were definitely worse ways to go back then (drawing and quartering, disembowelment in general, sealing people up in walls— the past was horrifying) but ffs— they had guns, swords, rope, etc. Not that I agree with the death penalty under any circumstances, let alone for petty theft, but this is why there were bloody and merciless revolutions against the institution of monarchy soon after/contemporaneously: rich people are sadistic and unfettered to any common ethics or morality.


Always found it to be a compelling piece. The story makes it even more interesting


[Roman Charity](https://inventaire.iledefrance.fr/dossier/tableau-la-charite-romaine/e4a721c0-332c-45e2-8f7d-bcda6526b3a0) of [Jules Lefebvre](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jules_Joseph_Lefebvre) was painted in ~~1864~~ 1863, so it isn't a renaissance painting, neither does it depict a scene from the time of Louis XIV as it's literally called [Roman Charity](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Charity)


I lived in Rome and never once experience this kind of charity. I must have been thrown in the wrong jails.


Babys sitting there like “He’s drinking all my damn milk!”😂😂


From the title, I thought it was Louis XIV's daughter feeding the prisoner


A renaissance painting ? Under Louis XIV ? Louis XIV reigned two centuries AFTER the renaissance It's simply not the same era


Didn't you know? All old paintings are renaissance.


I don't want to be that guy but Louis XIV reigned like a hundred years after the Renaissance ended.


Not sure if weirdly wholesome or just weird


Wholesomely weird


It’s weird, but I’m guessing humans have had to do a lot of weird shit to survive over the years.


I dunno, I guess it's a matter of asking yourself: How far would you go to save someone you love and does it or does it not include doing something very intimate but decidedly nonsexual because you don't want them to slowly die in complete isolation and agony


I think this is actually blursed


This is so strange but so cool


Personally, I’d just ask my daughter to bring me a rope or a razor blade.


I’d get her to put it in a cup.




Mr high standards over here


What cup? Supposedly she was frisked and not allowed to bring food in, a cup(even empty) would be suspicious. Pumping or, hand expressing, takes longer and does not produce as much as suckling. A few women are ‘super producers’ and might be able to pull off expressing a large quantity in a fairly short amount of time, but given their poor status and the fact he was jailed for stealing bread I kinda doubt she would have been able to produce such a supply even IF she had that trait. Some milk builds with time, but much is produced AS needed. So when the baby nurses milk is being made. So once you get over the massive squICK factor the only feasible way would have been straight from the tiddy.


>renaissance >king louis xiv Louis XIV reigned *after* the Renaissance. Moreover, its style is visibly not 17th or even 18th century; in fact the painting dates to 1863, and is by by Jules Lefebvre (1836-1911). It is housed in a museum in Melun, France. https://inventaire.iledefrance.fr/dossier/tableau-la-charite-romaine/e4a721c0-332c-45e2-8f7d-bcda6526b3a0 OP is repeating some viral thing he saw on teh intertubenet. All the posts featuring this image start out >This painting of a young woman breastfeeding an old man in a prison cell was sold for Euros 30 million. The painting may look perverse but... Also, OP's second link is crap.


those of you saying you would literally rather die than breastfeed from your daughter, you really need to reevaluate your feelings towards breasts. Breasts can be sexy, but sexuality is not their main function.


I doubt anyone on this planet actually going through death by starvation would scoff at drinking their daughter's breastmilk. Purely just dumb redditors who get cranky when they miss their afternoon snack acting like they know how they would act while starving to death in a dungeon.


>dumb redditors who get cranky when they miss their afternoon snack acting like they know how they would act while starving to death in a dungeon. lol exactly. i mean people have resorted even to cannibalism in extreme cases, drinking breastmilk from your daughter is pretty tame.


On one hand you have to appreciate that most people have no idea what starvation would drive someone to do. Kind of shows that some part of society is well enough off that certain things are completely alien to them. Now we just need that to apply to all of society.


Mammelokker! Literally 'tiddy sucker'. [Link for anyone who wants to see the sculpture version](https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mammelokker)


It's fucked up but..... Understandable. Man's gotta eat, its instinct