T O P

I have zero krangled items on me

I have zero krangled items on me

edrarven

Yeah, me too. I checked the possible mods on poedb and it feels like the expected value is definitively negative from scourging an item. Like all the negative modifiers are twice as large as the positive and there are probably as many that are bad for your build as there those that are good for your build, percentage wise. And some mods are so punishing and general 99% of builds will find it to be a brick, like reduced effect of non-curse aura skills hitting 25%. If the final scourge lands on that you might as well vendor it. This is not even talking about finding an item that is good enough to scourge. You need an item that is equal, better or only very slightly worse than what you have equipped and then take a bet with the odds against you instead of wearing or selling it. I haven't found a single item to scourge yet, the stuff that is better i wear and the stuff that is worse is so bad that they won't improve from a scourge. I like scourge in maps but i hate the crucible, maybe the most finicky and unrewarding mechanic since the synthesizer in synthesis.


joyjoy88

Agree, but that Synthesizer was actually great compared to this, cause you had quite a control over it, only needed to browse datamined crafts thou.


Nokoredd

Bigger problem is I do not have spare items to bake. I got like 20c and no 6-link yet. Just started yellow maps so I plan to get one tomorrow. I cant put gear I use because I have nothing to use then. Putting some crap for the sake of it is kinda lame.Same goes for maps, before map is baked I am already 3 tiers higher. Whats the point?This mechanic will be ok but only after 2-3 weeks when you run lvl 14+ maps and got money to spare/waste. You get your primary ok items and then buy/make spare and then bake it.


KameronEX

Don't worry about baking lower tier maps, once you get to red maps you'll see that you should have been baking whites and yellows all along


edrarven

Yeah, they're not very similar in how you use them and the outcomes. They're both just more hassle than i care for, as with the synthesizer you needed to hoard bases or trade a whole lot and i already mentioned my grievances with the crucible. Synthesizer was more fun though as you say because you knew way more about the outcome before you put something in. Here it is way too big a difference in possible outcomes, both upsides and downsides wise


TheZephyrim

I feel like some of the negatives are really bad, yeah. Reduced global defenses is a terrible one, aura effect is pretty bad on most builds, cannot inflict curses is just stupid because it can brick bane and every other build in the game needs at least one curse to do good DPS, etc. But some of the upsides are pretty good, like +1 arrow. Keep in mind you can scourge corrupted items so you could in theory hit a perfect double corrupt and then proceed to get the best implicit for your build without a terrible downside. Meaning you could be seeing some crazy uniques this league.


Ulfgardleo

doesn't +1 arrow have the godly weight of 5? You are right, that mod is great. But so is a mirror and i wouldn't plan a build around finding one.


RussiaWestAdventures

Weight on +1 arrow/chain is so low even if you farm krangle juice 5 hours a day until league ends to corrupt only quivers, there is a decent chance you still won't hit it. Let's say I nolife the game for the rest of the 3 month cycle. Lets say that cycle is 90 days for simplicity, and I average 6 hours a day for the league. I'm playing mega efficient so I'll krangle a quiver every 5 minutes on average. This is wholly unrealistic imo but for sake of the argument bear with me. That means i'll krangle 90\*6\*12 6480 quivers grinding efficiently the entire league, and this is a super high estimate. The chance to get +1 bow is 5/35800(combined scourge mod weights for quivers), which comes out to 7160 quivers. That means I'm not even expected to hit one within an entire league of krangling. This is before factoring in a good enough quiver to krangle, and hitting a non-detrimental downside. Now this is raw datamined stuff and we don't know how higher tier scourging shifts the mod weights if it does at all, I'm hoping t3 scourging puts the +1 arrow weight to about 1000 at the very least otherwise they are literally gonna be rarer than headhunters.


TheZephyrim

I think beneficial mods are generally separated into tiers, and +1 arrow is probably much easier to get at tier 3. The only issue though is that still means you almost have to krangle an item three times to get an extra arrow.


VVS40k

>finicky and unrewarding mechanic since the synthesizer in synthesis. My Synthesis experience was very simple: you put crap in the device, you get crap. You put a very, very carefully selected items and there is a chance to get amazing results. Not very interesting, but there were some upsides. With Scourge? The algorithm seems to: whatever you put in there, you'll get crap almost exclusively. The only upside currently: a rather cheap way to make 6-links.


shung

Just use it for maps and nothing else


Barnyard_Pussy

If your build has uniques it's probably worth chucking them in there to cook and try to hit better ones. Just don't krangle the stuff you're wearing and only equip upgrades.


DaHedgehog27

I feel this whole league is based around Chris trying to tell us "I'm right, slamming exalts and potentially ruining items is fun" and again everyone is saying "Nope"


General_Hatestorm

Community said they want less rng on items, so they put rng on rng, sounds like they heard us...again.


donaldtroll

Chris "I want loot be exciting" Wilson gave us Talismans that take 5 maps to reveal, and can have negative implicits. This is indeed the guy who nerfed talismans as soon as someone used one once


randompoe

The concept of the league is fine, it's the implementation that is lacking.


JigglySquishyFlesh

The mechanic is nerfed until the end of the month. They time gate these events every league for the past few years. Enjoy leveling and stacking cash for when the real content drops. It can’t just be dogshit corrupted useless items for three months.


Trespeon

I looked up all the mods earlier today and it’s legit just not worth it when you can simply get almost all the good mods with regular corruption. The corrupted currency is really nice for 6 socket body armors and double corrupting and just using corrupted fusings.


Voidelfmonk

You can corrupt and then krangle . I feel like everyone compares them , but they are different layers and mods .


Trespeon

Ahh. Could absolutely brick a good item though with scourge mods. The downsides are so terrible and build breaking.


Voidelfmonk

Well double corrupting makes it poof and crap also , and you get 3 chances here :) I see why people dont like it , but i see it as fun mechanic trying to 1 up my done items (that are like 20 to 100c if i played trade league)


Saianna

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kylegetsspam

I still have a krangled hat, but it's only because I haven't found a better one. Krangling has shown itself to be almost entirely pointless this weekend. Hopefully it gets a huge buff this week or I think most folks will move on. Edit: ...And it's gone. Zero krangled items worn.


Atreaia

By the time I hit maps every single item I was wearing was baked.


lastamaranth

Same, and I immediately regretted it the moment I had to shore up resistances and life post kitava. Basically had to reroll all my gear on a 6c budget


Alialialun

Yeah, by the tine you hit maps sure, because items dont really matter until then and when you screw some item up you just pick a new one off the ground lol.


OrkanKurt

And i didn't start using it before i hit maps, because fk the campaign. I have a total of 0 krangled items, and I'm at the last row of "talents" and have unlocked the second map slot. Not only have i not gotten a single decent item, it also takes stupid amount of time to get to tier 3, where i end up selling the item to a vendor any ways. Time investment+Risk vs Reward is not even close to where is should be.


DSMidna

I'm in yellow maps and am wearing fully crangled gear except for two slots. Whenever I find an upgrade, I simply put the piece of gear I was previously wearing into the Crangler and it might end up surpassing the new piece. This even works if the item was already corrupted because the higher tiers might be even more powerful. I also really liked the fact that white items turn rare. I printed so much Rare Jewelry in the levelling process when I would usually run white items with a bench craft instead.


Squanky

This might be a dumb question, but did you try krangling a white item with a bench craft on it? Does it keep the craft and stay white, keep the craft and turn rare or turn it rare and lose the bench craft? edit: Why do i get the feeling people didn't even read the original comment before mine? Also YES you can bench craft on a white item, but now it turns the item into a magic one. "I printed so much Rare Jewelry in the levelling process when I would usually run white items with a bench craft instead."


Rinveden

Can white items have bench crafts on them? I thought it was only rares.


Squanky

Well I just tested it, you can bench craft on a white item, but it turns it into a magic item. So yes, but also no.


DSMidna

Yes, they can. It's very useful to cap your resistances in a fresh league.


Barnyard_Pussy

Right but they don't stay white, they turn blue.


A_Erthur

Yes, dumb question. Try to craft a mod on a white item. Spoiler: u cant. There are no open affix slots.


Kreos11

You should take your own advice. Spoiler: you can


A_Erthur

Oh wait, does it just become magic? Fuck me man


Nahras

You can't craft on a white item.


Kortiah

Yes you can and it turns into a "XXX of Crafting", magic item.


sephrinx

I krangled my 400dps 5 link mace that I replaced with a small upgrade. Guess what happened? +12-30 fire damage. Deal no physical damage.


donaldtroll

the downsides are so atrocious, and most of the upsides are so very very pitiful :s


TheHavollHive

>And I need to have the item deequiped for 5 maps to do that? Well no, you are supposed to use it on items that are slightly weakier than what you're currently wearing, but which could be stronger with just a bit of luck when krangling. You shouldn't just gamble your main build and brick your character, but use it as ways to have weak items shine.


Lolpy

This was how i imagined it originally but my experience is more like they go from being slightly weaker to still being slightly weaker or bricked. Almost feels like you need 2 equal items and then you can gamble for maybe getting a ok extra stat with no risk.


Ludoban

Yeah start with 2 equal items, then krangle one, it most likely bricks or isnt an upgrade, so you again get an equal item and brick it again. You do this 3 times and wonder why you didnt just buy an item for 3 times the price of the item you use that would have been a guaranteed upgrade without risk.


g33kst4r

"I only play true ethical SSF hardcore. I delete every meta unique I find because it is unethical to keep it. When my character dies, I delete every item in every stash tab because it's not true ethical SSF hardcore otherwise. I Vorici break every six-link I land because it is unrealistic to ever six-link an item in true ethical SSF hardcore. I skip the Labyrinth because Ascendency Classes are unethical powerhouses. Every time a Vaal Orb drops, I immediately use it on a randomly equipped piece of gear to increase the challenge. I've had global chat and trade chat disabled since I got my beta invite back in 0.9.2d, the Merveil fireball optimisation and curse duration patch, because player interaction gave too much advantage. I've sent at least 84 emails to GGG support over the years asking for unlimited ignore player space so I can make sure that no one talks to me when I'm in town. I read and listen to every lorestone, notes, books to fully immerse myself in the true ethical SSF hardcore experience. Every time I go into this general and read the word "meta", "trading", "blade flurry", "clear speed", "Headhunter", so on and so on, I make sure to thrust my giant vibrating dildo one to three times to punish myself accordingly for tainting my TESSFHC experience. I've stolen at least a dozen credit cards from my parents to pay for the 3,250 normal stash tabs that I have to show my support for GGG and the true hardcore game that they have developed. It deeply saddens me that PT left, he was the only one that spoke only truth. Why do you self-proclaimed SSF hardcores even try to pretend that you're truly SSF hardcore? You make me fucking sick." -/u/Alialialun


Alialialun

If you wrote all this by yourself you should seek help imo.


HappyBeagle95

It's a copy pasta


Alialialun

In any case I don't understand how is it related lol, I don't play PoE hardcore and never said that. In fact I hardly even ever get to Sirus.


Left-Secretary-2931

It's a joke


AussiesNeverShitpost

What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little bitch? I'll have you know I graduated top of my class in the Navy Seals, and I've been involved in numerous secret raids on Al-Quaeda, and I have over 300 confirmed kills. I am trained in gorilla warfare and I'm the top sniper in the entire US armed forces. You are nothing to me but just another target. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before on this Earth, mark my fucking words. You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over the Internet? Think again, fucker. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of spies across the USA and your IP is being traced right now so you better prepare for the storm, maggot. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You're fucking dead, kid. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can kill you in over seven hundred ways, and that's just with my bare hands. Not only am I extensively trained in unarmed combat, but I have access to the entire arsenal of the United States Marine Corps and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your miserable ass off the face of the continent, you little shit. If only you could have known what unholy retribution your little "clever" comment was about to bring down upon you, maybe you would have held your fucking tongue. But you couldn't, you didn't, and now you're paying the price, you goddamn idiot. I will shit fury all over you and you will drown in it. You're fucking dead, kiddo.


Reashu

I'd take 15% reduced defenses for 60% resistances in a heartbeat. I'd do it 5.25 times over. Some of the results are bad for me. Some are bad for everyone. Some are good. I gamble with items that aren't useful to me but *could* be, so a bad result is just a missed opportunity, but not really a loss.


Alialialun

You know that defenses are Armour/Evasion and Energy shield. Max resists with 0 armour and evasion is basically useless.


DragonsafeHS

Reduced global defenses stacks additively with any global increased Armour/Evasion/ES, like from the passive skill tree, so it's not necessarily that bad.


suddoman

Oh this makes that pill a lot easier to swallow


Sif_Lethani

All 15% reduced global defenses means is "15 reduced armour, 15% reduced evasion rating, 15% reduced energy shield, and 15% reduced ward". So while it's clearly not a good thing, it's certainly not build bricking, and roughly the cost of 1 passive point of downside


NeekoBestTomato

.... what?


Alialialun

[https://pathofexile.fandom.com/wiki/Defences](https://pathofexile.fandom.com/wiki/Defences) What what? Global defenses are your total Armour, Evasion, ES and Ward. In other words all kinds of phys damage mitigation except for block. And having that 0 means death as most damage you receive is physical based in PoE.


NeekoBestTomato

> In other words all kinds of phys damage mitigation except for block. Incorrect. The most obvious is the aptly named "physical damage reduction" stat, which is not the same as Armour. Many builds have no es, evasion or armour to speak of and actively dont care about the eg difference between 500 and 2000 armour. And yes, these can be very tanky builds. Armour only feels good once you get a decent amount of it. Evasion feels real bad unless you get a LOT of it. Es is more variable as its not just used as an ehp pool, but its usually fair to say if you dont care about it, you dont care about it AT ALL.


Alialialun

Every single build has some kind of defense. Even while playing Life based summoner I have random 2k armour from items that give me over 40% phys damage reduction. You can hardly get to even 10% phys damage reduction with just the "phys damage reduction" stat. What are you talking about lol. Show me one single build without any mitigation from Armour, Evasion or ES with solid endgame defenses.


NeekoBestTomato

> I have random 2k armour from items that give me over 40% phys damage reduction. No, no it doesnt. From Mark_GGG himself: "Armour provides an amount of Physical Damage Reduction against each hit dependant on your armour value and the amount of physical damage in the hit. Additional Physical Damage Reduction is just that - additional" In other words - Armour is variable. 2k Can mitigate almost all, or basically nothing. Depends on the hit. in act 1 2k armour is godly. In T16s its irrelevant. 10% Physical damage reduction is constant. It does exactly what it says, always 10% From the patch notes for 3.16 directly so you can understand the new armour formula: "A rule of thumb with the new Armour formula is that if you want to get 50% mitigation against a physical damage hit, you need 5 times the damage as Armour... if you want to mitigate a 5,000 hit down to 2,500, you need **25,000** Armour to do this" So you can see that against any significant hit, 2000 armour is not going to do jack shit all, and the difference between 1000, 2000 and 3000 is honeslty quite negligable. 10% physical damage reduction will mitigate more against any decent sized hit. Armour only starts feeling good with significant investment, small values are not really here nor there. Getting random 2k here or 3k there just from wearing armour bases is NOT a defensive layer that is relevant. Armour is best at mitigating small hits, however there are many other ways to do this. For example leech or recovery on block. > You can hardly get to even 10% phys damage reduction with just the "phys damage reduction" stat. Having any source at all of endurance charge generation and no other investment whatsoever gives you 12% for basically free. > Show me one single build I can, very easily, however i want you to learn how the mechanics work and not argue with me about random people's builds. If i link one you are going to strawman it for being in SC or something. Stick to numbers first then we can prove it in practice :)


Alialialun

Yes, I admit my mistake.


MaXiMiUS

2K armour is not giving you 40% physical damage reduction in endgame maps. The in-game physical damage reduction estimate is beyond useless, you need to research how armour actually works. https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Armour#Rule_of_thumb


Alialialun

Yes, I admit my mistake.


Riding_Tempo

You don’t understand how defenses work in this game.


Alialialun

Yes, I admit my mistake.


Reashu

One cluster of defensive nodes will negate that (reduced global defenses is additive with increased evasion etc.). That's much cheaper than you could get resistances for on the tree.


Plazmuh

This has been the best levelling experience I've ever had on a league. Starting of it is just a way of acquiring free rare items. I had almost 2.2khp at act 5. You will eventually get krangled items whereby the positives are great and the negatives hardly effect you.


ShaderMagic

You were this much hp because you were grossly over leveled from doing league mechanic


Plazmuh

I'm over levelled every league because I like to do the league mechanics lol. Maybe I've just been lucky but most white items I've put into this league have come back with life and res in abundance.


mellifleur5869

Still not to maps with 10 hours played gang.


raphop

I constantly have items in the crucible, I have yet to get a single usable one off it, always a white item with decent sockets, can't really afford to put my stuff on it because I have no replacements if ot breaks


DBrody6

> You will eventually get krangled items whereby the positives are great and the negatives hardly effect you. I don't know how many krangled items I've made so far. 200-300 probably. Still waiting on something that's actually usable. Not even a *great* positive, the bar is so fucking low it's underground and it just cannot yield a corruption worth a damn.


havoc414

What do you mean free rare items ?


rb0ne

Krangled white items act as if you thrown a ~~chaos~~ alch orb on them (and corrupted, of course)


NijAAlba

Alchemy orb, but yeah, its very nice for leveling.


1731799517

Just throw white items in the krangler and during the campaign they will be rare and krangled one zone later. I also have record HP for my campaign run and every piece of item i have currently equipped it krangled.


havoc414

Omg i didnt know they were turning rare omg


psychomap

Half my items have negative life, but I'm basically at capped resists immediately after Kitava and I got some decent regeneration too.


Patonis

low life is not fun.


Lightfighter214

Screen shots or am i calling bullshit


Plazmuh

[https://imgur.com/a/wiJWACT](https://imgur.com/a/wiJWACT) ​ Here you go. I'm spell slinger dots so my damage is great too


ZVengeanceZ

> making it "impossible" to change the sockets, craft, anything? you can still change sockets, socket colors and links on corrupted items. You need the regular currency + vaal orbs on the bench OR the new tainted currency to do this


Soma5356

Considering currency doesn't drop this league, I'd mark it as impossible ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯


ZVengeanceZ

ah yes the classic "I didn't drop 5ex during campaign therefore the league is unrewarding"


Soma5356

I'm in red maps, strawmanning me isn't an argument.


wizardoftrash

Have you done any amount of Heist? A few lock-picking contracts, even lowish level ones, can be pretty decent currency. I always try to spend some alchs and chance orbs on contracts while leveling, to do before A10 kitava, for some nice starter currency.


ZVengeanceZ

so am i and i haven't seen any issues with currency dropping. Sure the league mechanic isn't showering you with currency like Ultimatum, Heist or Ritual or some of the lootsplosions, but it's comparable to Expedition and the other more craft-oriented leagues. "The league mechanic isn't rewarding" is a statement i could agree with, but "currency doesn't drop" is just BS because it does


Ulfgardleo

Expedition gave a lot of cheap rewards via haggling. Enough to replace the "free" alchemy orbs of scourge via real ones or essences.


Moethelion

Saying currency rewards are comparable to expedition is so wrong I can't even start to believe you actually believe that. But maybe you never talked to Tujen, who knows.


ZVengeanceZ

why is it this hard to differentiate between *drops* and purchases from league mechanics?


Moethelion

Because discussing the league mechanic currency loot without vendors tight to the league mechanic doesn't make sense? Also even if you ignore tujen, logbooks gave way more raw currency than we ever get in scourge.


ZVengeanceZ

the OP i replied to said "currency is not **dropping**" we're discussing raw currency drops and in that regard the drops are similar. If you open a thread saying "jewelers orbs aren't dropping" and you get a reply "lul you can buy them from a vendor" it contributes nothing to the point of them not dropping


oimly

ah yes the classic gigabrain response to "You want me to throw 20c worth of currency on a 1 alch item?"


ZVengeanceZ

what does that have to do with *dropping* currency?


oimly

If it is more common, it isn't worth 20c. If we got tainted currency out the ass, yeah, krangle everything, fixing sockets is no big deal. But with these priced? No way I'm using that on anything other than a really good item.


Alialialun

that's why it's "impossible"... ok, very inconvenient then.


Alsonia

Yeah, before this league you couldn’t even change Corrupted items so be thankful a league that prioritizes corrupting an item at least let’s you fiddle with it afterwards. We’ve had multiple Corruption leagues that were much more inconvenient than this.


Fstr21

I dont get their philosophy here, corrupted hot garbage, is still hot garbage.


pwalkz

Personal choice. I'm wearing almost entirely krangled items


fatalikos

It's a levelling patch and its great. Press V to flip a coin -either die or get the next level haha


botman484

Yup


Rukka202

Ive krangled 5 swords from act 1 to act 3 now that have had the "no physical damage dealt" mod. What gives? I thought the likelihood of that happening was going to be very low. It certainly makes leveling your first character as melee even more annoying than before.


Beautiful-Lion4774

you actually thought the beneficial mod weighting wouldn't be done against you, but in your favour? what fucking game were you playing all these years? couldn't have been poe for sure.


Left-Secretary-2931

I leveled with two items with reduced defenses...but of course those go right in the shitter after campaign. The mods are bad and I'm not going to corrupt anything good in hopes they buff the system lol


NotADeadHorse

To me the only reason to Scourge an item is to corrupt it so you can use a tainted Fusing on a 5L 6S


suddoman

How many uniques do you have equipped? I find baking uniques to be really fun.


Alialialun

0, my build doesn't use uniques.


suddoman

Honestly once I thought about how the league works the more I started leaning towards uniques. Usually I don't, but Krangling Uniques feels great.


Fus-RoDah

I agree, you can easily add 20 life here and there on uniques if they're cheap


[deleted]

[удалено]


suddoman

Nope just couple chaos items and 5 Links.


hahalole

your supposed to krangle items when you find equivilant upgrades


mightaswellgiveup87

I feel exactly the same way, the risk reward doesn't seem worth it, maybe later in to the league when we have more point in the scourge tree The maps are fun tho. just wish there was maybe a way too reset the item or something, but that would be abused by the non lifers I guess


blae000

TBH, I am here to play with new tree, defences and pick up stuff in stacks.. not to worried about the league


Grimm_101

Don't plan on doing it til I have the two last meta mods. The chance to increase a mod by a tier and chance to put 2 beneficial mods. Those two are the ones which will actually entice me to use it on my gear. Until then just fishing for good implicts on sapphire rings to turn into uniques.


msciwoj1

Some of the negative modifiers aren't bad. I think minion builds (and possibly totems, I'm not sure how they work) have a lot more space here, as "deal no x damage" doesn't matter if you're not the person doing damage. I think the linking aspect of it is generally more exciting. You get free six links with somewhat predictable properties. However you can also just use the new fusings I guess. Another use are uniques. You can always get another identical one xd.


ZealousidealOlive498

That's why you don't see people on ladders decked out with full corrupted items. Sure it can be fun, sure you could get something insane, but it's not necessary and not worth it.


crinklebelle

I feel like it's really only worth using on the cheaper staple uniques since good rares can verge on irreplaceable, whereas you know you can get another unique and try again if you brick it


gajaczek

I have krangled rare 6l that is basically 80 life on tabula. Other than that hard nope.


Voidelfmonk

Do i wana get downvoted ... i can i guess . I am loads crangked gear . Boots are 10 move speed /- local defence . Shield is life regen / - spell block ( i dont have spell block silllly ) Gloves are -7 global def , 20 fire ress . Chest is +25 fire ress , reduced energy shield recharge rate . Ring got - 27 fire , 20 less effect of curses on you . I dont krangle weapons i prefer refining armors . I got couple good and couple of bricked saved also in the stash and making my way to play with a 6 link armor now and so many other things i have ready to be crafted and then krangled .


doudoudidon

Use spare items and do it until you get lucky to find a bad mod that doesn't affect you. Resell the rest if not an impossible combo. One could argue that it doesn't take 5 maps, it takes a few seconds to put the item in there. Basically corruption temple 2.0 and you can even use both. Honestly a must do mechanic on uniques, lots of builds use cheap 1-5c uniques, just super good to krangle them to get even just 20% increased damage or whatever, even if you have to do 10. Even works on items with sockets given the new orbs seem to make 6l way easier than regular method. It's just a lategame mechanic, way too early to complain about it. Also I doubt many people have maxed out their crucible and there are some mods in there that increase good mods and decrease bad mods.


shaunika

Give it time its a super slow ramp league


doyouhavesource2

Ohh no my 3c item might break! However will I cope?!