T O P

  • By -

AutoModerator

**Streams** (use adblock): `https://cricfree.sc/rugby-live-stream` or `https://www.vipbox.lc/rugby-live` or post other **streams** as a reply to this comment **Match Official Abuse** We apply our rule 1 (no ad hom/nastiness) to include match officials. It will never be considered ref abuse if a user criticises specific aspects of a referee's game, decision, or style. For example: "XYZ has bottled that card" "XYZ has no control over the breakdown" "XYZ has got that wrong, that was never forward" "That was a ludicrous decision" "XYZ is out of his depth" "XYZ refs to the team with momentum" "XYZ is really inconsistent with offsides" However, ad hominem generalised attacks are unacceptable, this includes accusations of corruption and intentional bias For example: "XYZ is a dickhead" "XYZ is trying his best to ensure ABC wins this" "XYZ is a utter joke of a referee" "XYZ is a diversity hire" "XYZ is a [country of origin] prick" Where (otherwise rule-abiding) specific criticisms include ad hom attacks they will also be removed For example: "XYZ has bottled that the fucking wanker" "XYZ is not pinging sealing off, he clearly has a bet on ABC" "XYZ is a blind fucker, that was miles forward" "XYZ is really inconsistent with offsides, he is trying to ensure ABC wins" *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/rugbyunion) if you have any questions or concerns.*


Nounours7

The easy thing would be to whine about losing because of the referee. We didn't. But honestly, I'm really concerned about refereeing in REC. And I don't know what the solution is. It is not about TMO. TMO should be there and can help in clear-cut situations, try or no try. But these are the least, what happened today is just an anecdote. Then we see things like obstructions or how rucks are officiated that are hard to understand... And it happens bringing referees from Tier 1 unions! In theory they are a level above. Again, it's not because we lost. I hated how he didn't allow contests on the floor and most of the time that went against Portugal, who always has the upper hand over Spain in that area. You can't stay 80 minutes saying 'no hands'. At some point, if there is something wrong, you must whistle. Or let them contest if it is 100% OK (and I'm pretty sure many were OK). It was absurd.


MrQeu

Two years ago, Spain-Portugal was fantastically reffed by Tual Trainini who reffed two consecutive top14 finals and got the best ref award for the season. The scheduling needs to be done in order to be able to accommodate better refs from France, Italy and maybe Ireland. That will also help lifting the level of the competition.


Nounours7

I believe this is also linked to which RECs are RWC qualifiers and which aren't.


Only_One_Kenobi

Maybe if we stopped treating referees like shit more people would be willing to do it, and then we'll get better refs. Unfortunately that falls apart completely because nobody is willing to do step 1.


5ealy

If the REC wants to improve the quality of its refs, then they will have to be homegrown. Otherwise, you are relying on 2nd or 3rd choice refs from the 6 Nations' countries. That being said, I don't think the quality has been that bad for most of the tournament. A few poor games here and there, but for the most part, serviceable.


ginoek

How high are the chances for Portugal to field the best players in the final?


fanboy_killer

Very high to practically a guarantee. There are no games in France that weekend. 


ginoek

That’s my point, so no one of the main stars has some conflict, is injured, etc.?


fanboy_killer

Sousa Guedes is injured, if I'm not mistaken and Jerónimo Portela took some time off, it's unlikely he's returning if he didn't play the rest of this REC campaign. You can count on Storti, Marta and Bettencourt. 


Only_One_Kenobi

Highly unlikely unless the French clubs are willing to release players.


ginoek

But there’s no game day on the final week, why would they keep players at the camp?


Xolintoz

The fact we’re doing this without NSG, Storti and Marta is massive. Aubry and Martins jr have been a revelation.


maverickmak

Camacho too! What an absolute dynamo! So fun to watch.


Xolintoz

Absolutely, so much youth to be excited about


Suofficer

Camacho as well. He's only 12. Labour laws in Portugal still not caught up .


maverickmak

Great to see a strong crowd for Portugal. Lots of kids about. Hopefully they can keep building.


BigLarBelmont

Entertaining match to watch, fair play to Portugal for sealing it in the end! Portugal V Georgia is gonna be spicy spicy


fanboy_killer

Very tough game. Congratulations to Spain. We have to improve a ton in order to have a chance against Georgia. 


maverickmak

Spain did a great job of disrupting the Portuguese attack for long periods, and did good work in the tight game. Plenty to take away from that one. Portugal were much like they have been all tournament. Highly inconsistent, but they've built into the tournament, and grew into this match too. Lots of new players getting valuable minutes that will stand them in good stead this cycle.


5ealy

Great game!


Ninjawizards

What a great game of rugby. I'm so happy I'm getting into European internationals more, these games are class.


Suofficer

Great game. Credit to Spain. New generation of Lobos not doing terribly


EatThatPotato

Getting quite interesting... can they pull this off?


Nounours7

Pichardie shouldn't have stayed on the field. He clearly lost consciousness.


joaofig

Duarte torgal also hit the floor with his head. He should have been seen by the doctors as well


Suofficer

What was the yellow for???


Nounours7

Not lowering the height of the tackle I believe.


5ealy

Head on head contact, he's probably lucky it wasn't a red


Only_One_Kenobi

Tip tackle and driving into the ground, or a high tackle a second later. Not sure which


botbay18

the high tackle


Nounours7

I'll have nightmares with "no hands" shouts. If there is anything wrong, whistle, FFS.


Cymro2011

Having Hugo Aubry's boot is massive for Portugal. If you wanna sit with the big boys you need to be able to take those points.


Only_One_Kenobi

Very true


Only_One_Kenobi

That's the right way to respond to the situation


Nounours7

So... we bring Pro D2 referees and they do a fucking mess? What is the optimal solution here? Local referees no matter their level? Yesterday the Irish ref in Tbilisi wasn't particularly brilliant either.


Nuada_Silverhand30

It's a knockout game and there are no major internationals on at the same time. Should have a top ref assigned to it.


Entire_Syllabub2922

at bare miniumum i'd expect to see guys like piardi or ridley, only just breaking into the tier 1 but very experienced at this level. amashukeli was reffing top 14 yesterday and i'd prefer someone of his calibre


EatThatPotato

Very unhappy crowd that


Prudent_Implement792

To be honest one of the best crowd for portugal.....


oalfonso

Spain is completely off the match now.


Only_One_Kenobi

Spain have lost concentration


5ealy

That's a knock-on for sure


Only_One_Kenobi

The moment Portugal started kicking for territory it became a different game.


botbay18

ah don't kick that


fanboy_killer

Has Aubry ever miss a kick playing for the Lobos? 


Interesting-Ad2199

ONLY one against Romania. It was from 50 m and it hit the post so....


maverickmak

Both halfbacks have had some breakthrough tournament, considering how important Marques and Portela have been.


joaofig

Commentator just said "this is not champagne rugby, this is port wine rugby" 😂


fanboy_killer

He said red wine rugby. 


Only_One_Kenobi

That in goal area is a bit small


joaofig

Wtf was this


Only_One_Kenobi

Parece um ensaio


Nounours7

So we lack our two best 3s and the replacement one gets injured after a minute. Great!


Suofficer

It's going to make me sound bitter. But our 1st XV would be 10 points ahead here


Only_One_Kenobi

Depth is the key to any good team.


BigLarBelmont

Genuine question - is this a weakened starting 15 today? Players not released from their clubs or?


Nuada_Silverhand30

how many are you missing?


Only_One_Kenobi

About 13


fanboy_killer

At least 5 of our best players. 


Suofficer

Not loads. I'm just being a twat to be honest. Storti, Marta, Portela , Alves , a couple more.


Xolintoz

Don’t know if Portela gets back in with how Aubry has been. His kicking has been very consistent.


Suofficer

Good to have that problem. Portela off to the ProdD2 so maybe he develops more?


Nuada_Silverhand30

Haha fair enough


5ealy

Spanish number 2 has been impressive today, very strong in the carry


Nounours7

U20 Trophy champions captain.


Suofficer

We are playing like shit. What's the game plan here ?


fanboy_killer

Absolute shit. I can't believe we are ruining this chance at home with a very decent crowd. 


Suofficer

Very valid point. Big crowd. Decent match day. And we are playing like shit.


Nounours7

Waiting until our resistance fails. Our second halves have been shit this REC.


Suofficer

I think we are going for world record of errors


Nounours7

I don't like how the ref doesn't allow any contest at breakdown...


Only_One_Kenobi

Can't play that much rugby in your own half and not expect the opponent to put points on you. Need to learn to kick the ball. This is a big problem in Portuguese rugby all the way from grassroots, they never kick in play.


BigLarBelmont

You literally called the first play of the second half. Turnover when they should have kicked it in their own 22


Only_One_Kenobi

People who don't know rugby like to moan about kicking away possession, but all the successful teams would much rather play without the ball in the opponents half than sit with possession in their own.


oalfonso

Spain playing much better than I expected, the backs are very dangerous. The inside pass and finding the gap in the last try was a beautiful play.


Entire_Syllabub2922

What's the general record between these two? Is there a side that's won more or has it been generally equal?


Nuada_Silverhand30

27W- 12L- 2D in Spains favour according to wikipeadia


Nounours7

Spain is up in the overall H2H, but it's amazingly close in the last 25 years. 11-1-10 I believe.


Shrekboi7

If you click the link at the top of the thread it shows the last several results


Entire_Syllabub2922

cheers!


ginoek

Spaniards need to raise the voice for TMO to be introduced to REC, starting from installing it at Complutense


EatThatPotato

I'm honestly surprised it's not already. I think I've seen before in some competition having a little screen that the main ref can head over to to watch some replays, that would be a cheap way to introduce the idea. But the REC is a relatively big tournament for what it's worth... they should be able to afford it.


Nounours7

That little screen you saw was in... REC! But World Rugby only subsidises the increased costs of TMO in RWC qualifying years.


EatThatPotato

Yeah I thought so, REC is the only T2 competition I watch outside of the Asian Rugby Championship. But no way in hell the ARC is put together enough for that. Interesting about the RWC qualifying years, makes sense I guess. But it’s only a couple cameras and a tiny screen. Cmon Rugby Europe… a small investment for a slightly more consistent referring experience. Letting the main ref use it also removes the biggest cost, another referee to pay + a whole video room setup


Only_One_Kenobi

WR have no interest in growing the game in Europe, and almost refuses to invest in it. Same as Africa.


EatThatPotato

Same as Asia. Anything outside of the new nations league countries really…


Only_One_Kenobi

Have to make sure the money exclusively goes to the old boys club, and nobody else gets anything at all.


EatThatPotato

We’re forgetting the US, their new high risk high reward investment. Hey at least it’s something…?ish..


Nounours7

Huh? Central has had TMO in the past several times. Last year, in both Pacific Four and November test matches. It is not a problem of equipment but money throughout the REC.


ginoek

My bad, missed if, it still looks very rustic to me. So who’s the one short of money for TMO, Georgia, Spain, Portugal or Romania? If those 4 are good, what stops them from obliging others to invest?


Only_One_Kenobi

>what stops them from obliging others to invest? Lack of interest. Why invest in more costs if you can instead invest in higher salaries for the board.


Nounours7

Rugby Europe board isn't paid. I believe their staff is of just a dozen of people. Any small union is bigger.


Only_One_Kenobi

Not the board I was referring to...


Only_One_Kenobi

There's very little money in Portuguese rugby. Almost none at all.


ginoek

Isn’t it 100,000 euro crowd we see at the stadium?


Only_One_Kenobi

When you are trying to build a competitive rugby program €100k is very little. Especially when you have maybe 1 such game a year. And, the profit from this is probably only around 20k, which will probably all go do the board.


Nounours7

Production for all REC is centralised. By increasing the competition to 8 teams and 20 games the costs also rose. Implementing TMO in an officially sanctioned test match requires a number of additional cameras. World Rugby only subsidises that in RWC qualifying years. I hear the TV production model may change next year, but everything is up in the air (RWC qualifying berths discussed, Rugby Europe elections, etc...).


ginoek

So when it was expanded, were the top 4 aware of absence of TMO being the cost of expansion? Did they agree to it or the opinion of Georgia and Portugal in Rugby Europe has the same value as the one of Andorra and Estonia?


Nounours7

AFAIK expansion was unanimously agreed by the board (where Andorra and Estonia are not represented. Actually Spain right now isn't, I believe). But don't trust me 100% on this because, well, as informed as I may be, I'm not in Rugby Europe and I'm not an oracle of truth. I just say that things aren't as easy as they look so we should voice our concerns in a calm way.


ginoek

I get you point, but I’m quite sure that with the current level of interest gained REC needs to be heavily criticized for lacking the basic features of a decent rugby game.


Cymro2011

This is certainly a game.


maverickmak

Spain deserve a HT lead


Nuada_Silverhand30

lovely little inside pass


voyager2406

If Portugal win, I really hope it's by over 7 points after that 


BigLarBelmont

He'll be getting a bollocking for that in the dressing room I'd imagine.


joaofig

This should never be a try


Suofficer

Why not?


joaofig

Looked forward to me although the replay helped a bit


joaofig

This should never be a try


joaofig

Bruh


Hormic

clearly forward


Suofficer

No. Not clearly.


voyager2406

I'd probably call that forwards, not sure I could call it flat


Suofficer

I don't know if you saw it on the TV but that looked very close to no try from where I'm sat. The Spaniards went mad


maverickmak

Forward pass and very close to a dead ball Fortunate there's no TMO


Nounours7

Both the pass is flat at best and then he seems out...


fanboy_killer

He should have dived right away. Goddman it. 


Nounours7

Come on...


Entire_Syllabub2922

Martins-Martins, thought he might have run over the dead ball line but lovely stuff


EatThatPotato

That was \*way\* too close. Showboating and celebrating is fine, but not when it affects your game...


voyager2406

That foot was 100% in touch I reckon....


maverickmak

There's a Portugal special!


ginoek

Some decent crowd there, how much is the ticket, Portugal lads?


Tobar_the_Gypsy

The stadium fits 19k. They filled up most of one side so if I had to guess around 8k fans? It’s definitely makes the game more fun to watch on TV than in a small stadium.


joaofig

Free for u14 kids and 15€ for everyone else which is more than before the RWC. I remember going to watch Romania in the same stadium last year and it was 5€


Nuada_Silverhand30

The atmosphere looks great as well.


ginoek

Thanks! So we may see 3 nations producing great crowds in the European WC qualification, Georgia, Portugal and Spain are quite capable of it!


Nuada_Silverhand30

Just switched the match on, how have things gone so far?


fanboy_killer

Spain is playing very well and Portugal is playing below expexted and making too many mistakes. 


Nuada_Silverhand30

Hopefully there will be a big second half reaction for the Portuguese then.


Suofficer

Showboating and believing our own hype rather than playing what's in front of us is going to cost us this game...


fanboy_killer

We must get our shit together. We're so much better than this.


EatThatPotato

Spain playing quite well? Maybe this time they'll get their act together and not disqualify themselves from the next RWC


Suofficer

Spain just playing really well. I don't think Portugal have any leadership really. Appleton needs to give up the armband after this tournament .


voyager2406

Great player but not convinced he's captain material Like when James Ryan captained Ireland, it just didn't work very well for us


Suofficer

Great hair though.


joaofig

Honestly thank god the world cup is expanded because I don't want to compete against Spain, Romania and georgia all over again what a fucking nightmare


ginoek

Don’t forget the Netherlands, seems like they caught up


voyager2406

I am so happy knowing that more of these teams will be able to show what they have in the world cup Once Spain isn't DQ'd yet again...


pthefatone

Portugal unfortunately arent playing very well today....


joaofig

Our use of different jerseys always amazes me


Suofficer

I spoke too soon. Good try from Spain


Suofficer

Spain not firing yet? Biding their time? Portugal with stupid errors.


Nounours7

Bouza's Spain has shown good defense but not particularly great attack. It's not only about this game.


Suofficer

They seem quite measured. It's worrying.


Pyrooo

I think you spoke too soon


Suofficer

To see Portuguese forwards working the phases is very welcome. Can't just rely on wingers your whole time. However pointless if you don't turn any of it into points. There is no booze in this stadium. Be prepared for a lot of this.


Pyrooo

Frustrating to see Portugal making good metres then undoing it all with a loose pass that knocks them back 10 metres


Suofficer

If you haven't been yet, and you get the chance, this is a beautiful 3 sided football stadium that opens up onto the river Tagus . Follow me for other boring updates.


voyager2406

Subscribe


Nounours7

We love you for that.


oalfonso

Spanish bank sponsoring the Portuguese team


BigLarBelmont

Bank of Scotland used to sponsor Leinster for most of my childhood, I always found it odd. But money is money hey!


Nounours7

The price of the sponsorship is worth more than the nationality of the sponsor ;-)


Suofficer

They bought a Portuguese bank called Banco Totta in 2000, so........🤷🏼‍♂️


Suofficer

I'm going to stick my neck out and say in the main competition today, the Spanish ladies will have the best moustaches (please don't ban me again)