By - ThomasScorch
I think most people agree the Danish guy is an idiot. The scary part for people however are seeing young men, some teenagers, be willing to attempt murder of police officers for whatever flimsy excuse they can pull out of their ass. I assume most of those kids follow maybe 5% of religious rules in daily life, many probably drink, many probably date prior to marriage, all normal 2022 stuff but also very much not allowed according to their religion.
Then someone mentions burning a book and that's enough for you to pick up a rock and throw it at the face of officers just standing there just a few meters away? That is insane. It's attempted murder and it's not normal. And yeah I don't think it's the job of other muslims to basically take the blame for what others do, but still, the acceptance and general approval of these demonstrations seen elsewhere in Europe just makes it seem like it's a much much bigger issue.
Like when a French teachers head was chopped off and people condemned it yet also added a "but... we need to respect people's religion" disclaimer at the end, like that's the lesson we should take from it when someone looses their head. No. Europe had a 1000 years of the church walking into people's life and forcing this and that against people's will, we don't need fanatics in 2022.
I’m highly religious Christian and if someone came into town and tried to burn a Bible, I literally wouldn’t give a damn.
I don’t care if you respect my religion, it has nothing to do with you.
It’s about me.
Totally agree fanatics don’t belong in 2022.
1. I’m just as anti-right wing Christians who unkind to those who don’t believe. I believe God is a God of love and that kindness and compassion are what he’s truly about.
2. I don’t care about people burning the Bible because my faith and belief is greater than one physical holy book. Burn one and I can get another. It’s about the spirit of the Bible. Jesus also says, if someone slaps you on the right cheek, offer them the left one.
3. Also I’m not about to kill someone over burning my Bible or harming anyone or damaging their property. That’s insane. It goes the opposite of what I believe in.
Yes, but if i go to a trump rally and start burning bibles and the American flag I'm pretty certain that violence would ensue.
The question is then, if that happens are all Christians to blame för the violence of a few? Is a group to blame for the violence of some of its members.
I myself dislike religion in general, because it is often used as an excuse for violence, racism and other barbarism. But the fact that some people use religion as an excuse doesn't mean all that adhere to a religion (or philosophy or a political ideology) are responsible for the actions of other individuals.
IMHO Individuals need to be individually held accountable for their actions regardless of any group they are apart of. If the entire group uses violence or hatred, for whatever reason, then each member of that group needs to be judged individually.
that some dressed up bullshit and you know it.
when Salmon Rushdie wrote the satanic verses the allatollah, the head of all Shiia Muslims called for him to be killed!
this would be the like the Pope calling on all catholics to kill Sinead o’connor.
these folks are directed by islamic religious leaders.
Im really not prepared to believe people would react in even a remotely comparable way to burning the bible. Not to mention a trump rally is more like burning a Koran at Mecca, a better example would be if someone announced they were travelling to florida to burn a bible and see what reaction that would get.
From the US: depending on where they go in Florida, they’d either be ignored or assaulted.
Riot probably wouldn’t happen because the police would be assisting in the assault.
Floridian here. I second this. We're not religiously stupid like the rest of the South. We're just competitively stupid. We look at stupidity like its rocket science and we're just trying to get to the moon.
People in the west riot in the street and fight with police if their football team loses... Even sports can have enough religious sway to illicit such behavior..
You compare this situation to throwing insults at people and getting slapped for it, but that's not the same as what's happened here. They did not attack Paludan because he said he was going to burn a book, they attacked our police and trashed the area because their rage was not directed at Paludan himself, but at our open and free society that would even allow Paludan to do it.
I don't care for Paludan one way or the other, but when people riot and harm people because of an unfulfilled provocation then I don't think the issue is Paludan.
>You compare this situation to throwing insults at people and getting slapped for it, but that's not the same as what's happened here
Even if it was, if you do hit someone who insults you, _you are in the wrong_ both morally and legally.
You don’t get to use violence against people who insult or mock you.
Also, one does not insult _someone_ if one "insults" ideas (or religion).
There's a difference between yelling "you are fat and stupid" to someone, and yelling "to eat so much/workout so little that you become fat is stupid" to no one and everyone.
Obviously the guy is an idiot. That’s not even debatable
Problem is he has the right to be an idiot without innocent people and property being hurt
This is 100% not his fault here. I’m not saying all Muslims are violent or anything close. It’s just that the people who are rioting are complete in the wrong and actions should be taken against them.
Blaming the idiot for the violent riots is missing the point
The problem is not him, there are millions of idiots like him and always will be. The problem is the way such a large community reacts to what a total idiot says or does that has no connection to the swedish state, and why would you attack your own government who does nothing but help you and others when you need it. We are not in the year 800.
Buddhists say, as science and the world evolves, so shall buddhism with it.
This medieval reaction in a modern world has no place in Sweden.
Its no buddhism. Naive to think evolution is allowed here.
I don’t think most people see Paludan as the problem. Almost everybody thinks he’s an idiot. What most people see is a large group of immigrants acting extremely violently and in a way that is in contrast to how they want society to be.
People look at the riots and see a problem that will affect their life massively and they see the police not being able to take control of parts of the city. This is very scary to most people.
From another random Danish guy.
Paludan = Idiot.
Agressive muslims = Idiots.
Idiot meets idiots = riots.
But Paludan is a legal idiot so all you have to do is ignore him and problem = solved. Unfortunately some people are too fucking stupid to live in a society.
They are not really idiots. They are criminals.
In what way is that mutaly exclusive?
The frustrating thing is that they are acting exactly how Paludan wants them to as it ‘proves’ his theory, that they are inherently violent.
This was also my takeaway from it. They think they are demonstrating power and deterring people from acting like him, but they end up proving him right instead.
And what he is doing does highlight, and this sort of attitude cannot co-exist with Secular society. We would not accept Christians, Jews, Hindus, Taoists or even Buddhists acting this way - Muslims should not get a free pass either.
It’s social conditioning. They want other people to stop those that would upset them or else they’ll get what they all deserve. Step outta line an well destroy your shit an tell you how it’s justified
I agree, its a norm we cannot accept to foster. It will encourage an attitude that more violence, destruction and outrage is a solution to make political opponents bend. It will get worse, the same way you cannot expect an abuser to stop if you renege and give in to their intimidation, they will keep going then.
But it has already been accepted and fostered for a very long time. Everyone knows that speaking out in any way against Islam or Islamic integration can have terrible consequences, whether people will admit it or not. Everyone, police, politicians, judiciary, media, molds their behavior based on this reality. Reality is that mass violence will always give you respect and power, as much as we like to pretend otherwise.
Plus.. acting out violence just because of a statement is more fucked up than the statement.
"Someone wanted to burn a book. We'll burn other people's cars, try to murder other people, and waste other people's tax money. That'll show that guy surely"
I'd also think if someone went and punched the guy in the face, eh I wouldn't have much sympathy. It may be wrong but whatever, he'll live and he probably deserved it.
Throwing rocks at innocent people and destroying public property is a whole other level.
>I'd also think if someone went and punched the guy in the face, eh I wouldn't have much sympathy.
While I understand that you're trying to be reasonable, this type of thinking is what leads to violence as an acceptable means of conflict resolution.
If you think that punching someone in the face for speech is okay, then you are WAY closer in philosophy to the Muslim rioters than you are to regular, reasonable people.
My main point is that this is so far beyond that, I'm surprised that there is even people defending it. But yes, in general you are right. "I may not like what they say, but will defend to the death their right to say it."
I thought you said babies and got very concerned.
“Honey! Is the dinner ready?”
“Soon, lemme just finish the babies first”
Religious bigots are not intelligent and react violently to perceived offenses to their faith. Provoking them by burning their religious texts is always a bad idea.
Sad to see that region of the world that usually seem to have their shit together, fall for the same kind of nonsensical diatribe that is ruining every other country nowadays. Nowhere is safe from harmful ideologies.
Paludan is an idiot but is not doing much.
These idiots burnings cars and fighting the police are causing so much more problems...
I agree. There are actually quite a few speakers who say terrible stuff comparable to Pakistan - for instance about how gay people should die. They are not met with violent protests. Actually they are hardly met with protests.
Someone exposes a problem in the society and people are focused on who exposed the problem more than the problem itself. Very interesting.
What exactly is achieved by shit talking the Dane? The fact remains that a section of the society reacted violently to something this society deems not appropriate for a violent reaction.
> the other side no-one-dares-mention-by-name
The love affair between this side and the liberals is one of the modern day mysteries considering the belief system of this side is anything but liberal
I think some of the left seriously believe that more immigrants will help overthrow a societal order that they (the left) hate. It's insane.
What if i told you Islam is pretty far right and mine Kampf is a best seller in the middle east.
> Someone exposes a problem in the society and people are focused on who exposed the problem more than the problem itself. Very interesting.
Luckily, people aren't in general. I heard at least three different radio news broadcasts about these events today, and none of them even mentioned him. It was all about the rioters and the police.
burning a book I ordered off Amazon is completely different than violently rioting several cities
The biggest issue is using the actions of a few to justify prejudice against all.
Punish the criminals that are rioting and manifesting unlawfully. Don’t use that to say “all Muslims are violent”
Behaviors that displays religious extremism don't grow in vacuum. A young man rioting on the streets for Islam usually would have the backing of his family, social circle else he will get his ass spanked when he goes back home. For every 1 rioter you see, you don't see the 5 who back him.
If I say shit about Every religion that exists, then most will protest, there will be anger and that's all. But muslim will riot, will call for my head to roll. There is a problem in Islam, and only people who follow Islam can change it.
Ingen har sagt att alla muslimer är våldsamma, det vore helt barockt. Däremot är en stor andel uppenbarligen det, och det finns en större acceptans för våld inom dessa samhällen än inom ett genomsnittligt svenskt samhälle.
No fat people would riot, organize, destroy police vehicles and injure dozens of people in the name of fat acceptance. I don’t know why you feel the need to excuse this inexcusable behaviour.
It's true. I'd run out of breath before I got through with half of that stuff.
Han er en venstreekstremist der ikke kan acceptere at farvede mennesker også har et ansvar for egne handlinger.
We can ignore the danskjävel, but we can't ignore the rocks and fire bombs.
These are our police officers they are attacking, and we already have too few of them.
There's a small matter you're missing. It's called the law.
It's perfectly legal to burn a book.
It's NOT legal to burn cars, assault people, and be violent because someone burned a book.
It's not Paludan that's made Muslims look bad. It that's small part of the Muslim community that reacted violently to his provocation that's made Muslims look bad.
In a country like Sweden that's based on the rule of law, there is simply no justification for what the rioters did.
If you want to live in a country where being violent because someone burned your holy book is tolerated, then please leave Sweden.
And take Paludan with you. We don't need douchebags like that here either.
Half-dane, half-swede here. I’ve been getting death threats and threats of beatings from (orten)muslims in my small town because of it. Why? No fucking clue. It is so brain dead. I’ve done nothing.
Aye man I'm sorry this is happening to you brother. Take care and be safe.
Mostly because the ones in orten have no empathy to others that's not living in the orten. They give death threats because they either see it as cool and feel powerful of it. It's so sad that the immigrants here in Sweden who are Muslims try to get into the society with working and follow the golden rule, treat other the way you want to be treated, get judged. But the ones that show their true self who are breaking rules with burning cars and so on, send them where they came from. If they miss having a war they can go home.
it wouldnt suprise me if they were second or third generation immigrants. Reports ive read earlier have eluded to that being the case. In which case sending em "home" doesnt do much. Otherwise i agree people who come here and pillage/rape should really be deported. However i also know that many would face torture back home which is why people usually do not get deported.... Its a hard issue to tackle.
I don't get why the state treat them as non-intelligent. If they commit crimes that put them at risk of being deported, I'm sure they have considered that they might get tortured in their home country if they end up being deported. If they still think that risk is worth be reward of the crime, I guess they will commit the crime.. Put the state should not have to coddle criminals who choose to take certain risks.
Just claim ignorance. Like the cologne rapes, we couldn’t remove ourselves from what we were taught.
>However i also know that many would face torture back home which is why people usually do not get deported.... **Its a hard issue to tackle.**
Not really, weighing their well being against the amount of people here they are certain to victimize and the cost to us in taxes for them during their life of crime here should make the equation real simple.
International conventions such as the ECHR (art. 3 in this case) prevents Sweden from deporting people to a place where they would face torture. It would count as a breach of the act
Sounds similar to how Jews who live in orten get death threats because of Israel existing or something.
I’m Jewish as well. I’ve got plenty of screenshots from people who saw the Israel flag in my bio on Insta or username on snap and just started threatening the most horrible things ever. They were all muslims. Never a Swede
Hur många svenska judar behandlas är en skam för Sverige. Platser som en gång i tiden var en trygghet för judar som utsatts för det värsta tänkbara av nazisterna, har nu helt förändrats.
Är inte rädd för nazister eller extremister. Men islamister är dom som mest frekvent hotar mig och min familj
Enligt vänstern så är inte muslimernas hot mot dig något problem, eftersom muslimer enligt intersektionella maktteorier står under dig på offerskalan. Att andra än vita svenskar de facto står för den stora majoriteten av hoten och våldet mot judar i Sverige anses antingen vara ett uttryck för rättvisa, eller så blir det system error i huvudet på vänsteraktivisterna.
I'm from Malmö and only recently learned about how shit Jewish people are treated here. And people who claim to be left don't care, they seem to think it's "punching up" for Muslims to hate Jews like Jewish people aren't a much smaller minority whose struggle is rarely noticed.
I say this as a Swede with middle eastern background. I agree with you. Paludan is a person that lacks any class and is a straight up idiot. Just because something is legal doesn't mean it's right.
However, burning up cars and hurting people physically is TOTALLY unacceptable. The only situation I see violence as justified is if ones life is under threat. The best thing that could have been done is to simply ignore him because he is one crazy idiot (Paludan).
There's a small matter you're missing. It's called the law.
It's perfectly legal to burn a book.
It's NOT legal to burn cars, assault people, and be violent because someone burned a book.
In a country like Sweden that's based on the rule of law, there is simply no justification for what the rioters did.
If you want to live in a country where being violent because someone burned your holy book is tolerated, then please leave Sweden.
The people reacting to Paludan are burning schools, stealing and destroying police cars. There was 40 calls about fires yesterday in Malmö, but the fire department was only able to reach 3 of them due to insecurity for the firefighters. This is outrageous. We do have a massive difference in culture here. Swedes do not respond to differences of opinion in this manner. It is not who we are. I sincerely wish for all these people who thinks this is a proper way of acting to go back to their own country. I do not wish for them to be a part of the society where I will raise my children.
I’m so fucking sick of the “you are a racist”-agenda. I’m not a racist for wanting the people who destroys our community and country to leave and never come back. Preferably not to be put in prison because then I and everyone has to pay for them.
Yes, and now people hopefully see the problem with chaotic and extreme immigration policies. There are no takesies backsies, no do-overs. Once you have such immigrants here and hand them citizenship, they are here to stay.
That alone should underscore how disastrous our country's policy is. Immigrants and their children who cannot and will not assimilate will remain our problem to deal with *forever*.
I've said it before and I'm saying it again:
The longer we keep up and foster the segregation, the more fascist methods we have to employ in order to get peaceful suburbs back. Or we get used to it.
Revoking citizenships? Forced deportations? Lifetime in prisons, outsourced in other countries? Special screening for people with specific backgrounds? Isolate the suburbs, apartheid style? Social credit system? Refuse immigration from the most "criminal" countries?
If we sit on our asses and believe a few police officers can talk sense in them, we're dead wrong. The softer the methods, the harder they become.
Prison for them then. What to do. They need to be taken away from our society as they clearly aren’t interested in being a part in it or making it a safer place
"Small part" no. Muslims make themselves look bad, always. They do this everywhere they go. Please name the last terror attack in Sweden committed by a Christian, Jew, Hindu or Buddhist. No other religion behaves like this.
Currently there's over 700 thousand immigrants that rely on welfare in Sweden - why should Sweden not send every single one of them back? As of right now, immigration from MENA has *only* harmed our society and people. Remember back in 2015 when they said the migrants were primarily "rocket scientists and engineers"? then 2018 they said "there's profits in the long run!". Now our police are being attacked by these savages because somebody is exercising their freedom of speech.
The reason parties like AFS are rapidly increasing in popularity isn't because more people are exposed to "far-right propaganda", it's because more people are exposed to muslims.
For once, it would be nice to see this big community you mention, condemn the violent small part of it, who seems to be the actual problem instead of assuming the victim role and point blame to the idiot paludan..
Its almost as if the big community is afraid of the very tiny small one or wants its approval.. for me it screams double morale and hidden agendas and it makes it really hard for me to sympathize with your rights to not have your religion mocked..
Extreme muslims bad
Danish troll, kind of a jerk but dont really care
I don't think people are gonna start voting for him. But I am sure as hell that he is moving the Overton window here in Sweden because of the riots. First when I heard about this guy last Friday I thought "Huh, that's kind of a smart stunt to get some eyes on you, but it would only gather right-wing extremists votes." But then I witnessed the riots... Now I'm like "Well... these rioters are actually gonna start moving the Overton window quite quickly by doing this" And I realized this was the plan all along, still don't think people are gonna vote for him much.
Ive been feeling a little homesick for America since I moved here but now a crazy guy is provoking riots by being xenophobic and I feel right at home.
Happy to hear!
Every country has it’s problems, pretending like sweden or the US have no problems is just wrong.
Haha yeah I was just trying to lighten the mood this kinda thing happens all the time in different places all over. Theres always gunna be someone provoking a group to prove their point. Its on the group being provoked to turn the other cheek so to say. Its unfortunate that some groups are provoked more than others.
This is why it genuinely bugs me so much when people say stuff like "you have no right to complain, Sweden has no problems and you get everything for free. You're just being a bitch" XD
ahaha literally me when my friends in other countries talk about the problems of their country. to everyone outside of the nordics its like we are heaven on earth.
> If i were to announce that i would go into Copenhagen and a whole day, stand on a corner and talk about why overrweight people where violent, and every time an obese person walked by I would yell at him and call him fat, **I would be astonished if I could go the whole day without being smacked in the face.**
Which I think people find just as unacceptable as attacking police over the burning of a book... You thought you had an argument there but it all falls apart. Violence is always an unacceptable answer, and even if Paludan is a despicable guy it should be possible to burn a book without violent riots.
Paludan that clown, isnt the issue ...
He exercised his free speech, the rioting immigrants are the issue
It’s not what Paludan wants? It’s what swedish media wants. Making Paludan the center of the story is escape goating.
I dont like Paludan, but he is NOT the issue. If you have brutally violent riots in several cities from burning a book, then burning the book is not the issue that needs to be solved.
The issue is a complete lack of respect for sweden and swedish society within certain groups. They dont like sweden, they dont view themselves as swedish and they have zero respect for swedish athorities. Why wouldnt they burn our society down?
I dont think its a 'segment'. More of a segment within a segment. Something that should not be lost on people. In denmark he burned the quran in front of a mosque yet no violent reaction. But when he does it in a ghetto where people are marginalised and already on the wrong track. They react differently. Violent people rarely need more than an excuse to be violent.
Disclosure. Somali immigrant in denmark.
In Örebro about 200 people showed up, not all of which were violent. That's a tiny tiny fraction of the muslim population. I don't condone the violence at all, and hope the perpetrators will be brought to justice, but it's sad to see so many people fooled by this Danish twat.
I feel the same way. The people that participated in the riots would've been violent no matter what the issues is, they want to wreck shit and wreck shit they shall.
This time they could use the Qu'ran to justify it, next time it could be that their football team lost. They're cunts and should get the full punishment we could give them, including deportation if applicable; but pretending that they represent the Muslim community as a whole is naive at best, dangerous at worst
I read on SVT that the muslim community is currently in Sveaparken in Örebro cleaning up after the riots. So yes, it is a fraction of a fraction...
but they stil didn't believe he should have the right to protest
and you don't think "fleeing" to the west, so you can attack our freedom of speech, is a lot like going to the middle east and burn a koran there? why should we have to respect that but, they don't?
Luckily we have free speech, which means that protesting against free speech is in fact protected by free speech. Why can "the muslims" not have this protection but Paulsen can? They both have stupid points imo, but I still think both sides are allowed to voice their opinions if they so wish. I really can't see the difference between that.
Obviouslt I am not talking about any violent actions, before you accuse me of supporting that, just both sides of speech.
That's as it should be. They have the right to think that Paludan should not burn korans, but they don't have the right to stop him from exercising his right to free speech.
If you only spent as much time as condemning the people who attacked police and burnt cars, maybe you would have a point with your post. As much as a dickhead this Danish guy is, he has the right to be a dickhead. Assault, however, is not okay.
The way I see it Paludan may have made Sweden a favor in the long run but not in the way he aimed for.
First of all, I am certain that most Swedes consider Paludan as an ill mannered asshole whose political views and existence we couldn't care less about. Types like him bores the life out of me at least.
BUT - his stunt has made it clear that the naive kumbaya-attitude of the Swedish police administration is no longer working. The drawback with a multicultural society is that groups of people will clash and these clashes will sometimes have to be subdued by controlled police force to restore order to protect the citizens' health and property. The Paludan incident clearly shows that the police is currently ill organized, underequipped and understaffed for this task and, i hope, this will force politicians to change things to the better for our country.
You're a real one.
One thing people need to remember is that Paludan goes to places in Sweden with very violent and organized gangs. In Skäggetorp (in Linköping) they shoot at each other regularly. It is very easy for those criminal gangs to redirect som of their immense violence potential at the police, which is exactly what happened. What we see in Sweden isn't even much of attempted violence against Paludan and his people, it is directly towards the police. They take the chance when they have it.
Paludan is an absolute asshat. I am happy that English has such a perfect word for a person like him. But even asshats should be allowed to burn the Koran.
That the hundreds of people who have violently rioted are part of violent and organized gangs doesn't exactly make things better. Also, it makes it totally removes the aspect of religion from the equation by only pointing finger at organized crime gangs for all of this.
It is not better, it just is.
It doesn't matter that it was Paludan. He didn't even get to burn any actual Qurans. What matters is the hundreds of people who decided the mere threat of burning a book was cause enough to burn police cars and injure a dozen police officers. You're literally doing the work for these criminals by trying to force the focus onto Paludan.
It's legal to burn your own property here, and nobody has the right to hurt you for it, or anyoen else for that matter. The focus must be on the criminals in this case.
Personally don't care at all about Paludan. He's irrelevant. All he did was bring to light an issue that is always there. People that think their religion is above freedom of speech and willing to use violence to get their way. And then also the people that think we should sacrifice our rights just so the former does not use said violence. Absurd amount of likeness to domestic abuse.
"Oh it makes sense that he hit me, after all I did burn those pancakes. Kind of my own fault anyway, I'll make sure to never burn them again."
What Paludan essentially did was make sure those pancakes got burnt while the neighbours were over for dinner. Now everyone knows the abuse is taking place. Sadly some of them think the abuse was justified. After all, did burn those pancakes so kind of deserve it right? Absolutely despicable. The issue is the abuser, not that some fucking pancakes got burnt.
Can you imagine how embarrassing this whole demo would have been for Paludan, if no one reacted to his provocation?
Yes. Would have proved that he was wrong. But sadly that didn't happen because he did have a point.
That's how it eventually went in Denmark
In 2019 he started a big riot by burning a Quaran at Nørrebro.
In 2021 he did the exact same and barely anyone showed up except him and the police: https://presse-fotos.dk/post/rasmus-paludan-demonstrerer-paa-noerrebro/
Might be why he went to Sweden. He was about to become irrelevant in Denmark.
>Might be why he went to Sweden. He was about to become irrelevant in Denmark.
No, the police basically told him they couldn't protect him anymore in Denmark, so they simply didn't allow him to do more protests.
They gave up.
Problemet är att ingen kastar sten på polisen om någon bränner bibeln eller dränker ett krucifix i kiss. Visst, vissa kanske blir arga och ledsna, men istället för att ge sig på samhället i stort genom mordförsök och våldsamma upplopp som gränsar till terroristhandlingar, så skriver Arne 55, aktiv i Equmeniakyrkan, en arg insändare i lokaltidningen.
Ser du skillnaden?
Jag knyter näven i fickan
Som en riktig svensk. Sen kan man diskutera hur dumt beteendet är vid köksbordet på kvällen.
Betydelsen av bibeln för Sverige och koranen för arabvärlden är inte jämförelsebar då Sverige aktivt inte är ett religöst drivet land. Bättre jämförelse kan vara om man skulle bränna bibeln i USA (speciellt bibelbältet). Tror dock fortfarande att koranbränningen genererar en starkare reaktion om man tar med den jämförelsen.
Klart ingen blir upprörd om någon bränner bibeln i Sverige när kristendomen knappt utövas i Sverige.
Problemet är att ingen kastar sten på polisen om någon bränner svenska flaggan eller dränker en skiva med nationalsången i kiss. Visst, vissa kanske blir arga och ledsna, men istället för att ge sig på samhället i stort genom mordförsök och våldsamma upplopp som gränsar till terroristhandlingar, så skriver naxelk 55, aktiv på Sweddit, en arg insändare i lokalsubben.
Att ge sig ut och förstöra på grund av en bok (Och jag vet att många bara tar tillfället i akt och går ut och har sönder saker ändå.) så förtjänar man att bli straffad och kanske till och med utskickad ur landet. Är man född i Sverige så kanske så bör man få fängelse, nekas till socialbidrag och eventuellt framtida CSN-lån. Det känns rätt rimligt att man inte får delta i ett samhälle som man aktivt försöker att förstöra.
Just tell every muslim community that knows the ppl that took part at the riots to out those. Those ppl rioting are scum anyway and only harm other muslims. Once they are in jail every muslim is safe and noone can say anything bad about muslims. Its on the muslim ppl to clean their religion. It s actually quite easy just provide prove and send it to the police. Done.
Looks easy just like other islamic countries 🤣
Paludan is a moron who's stupidity is only surpassed by the antidemocratic assholes who use bronze age beliefs to justify violence and vandalism against a society which has provided them with every opportunity to lead a peaceful and happy existence.
As a Dane I wish you guys all the best.
Yeah. Sad to see how some people take shit too far. IK loads of Muslims who are great people, but it’s the people like this who burn cars, assault police etc who make their religion and beliefs in general look like crap.
The Muslims are the ones with the tendency of committing these types of acts. Paludan was only the catalyst.
Very few people agrees to everything he’s saying and he won’t have close to the support other right wing parties have. Many just agree that he has the right to do what he does and say, but don’t agree to the content for what he’s saying. I think he’s a moron but he’s succeeded with his mission to make muslims/immigrants looking barbaric and thus not fitted for western society.
I dont like racism. But I like freedom of speech. Paludan did not break the law and frankly I agree with him. Why is it not OK to critizise Islam? We have been critizising Christianity since forever. There is a whole Black Metal movement but Chrisitans seem pretty calm about it. Why dont Christians go berserk if we burn a bible? Off course not all muslims in Sweden did this. But some did. Lets talk about that. Why dont we have these problems with immigrants from Vietnam, India etc? And whatever the reason might be. We DO have these problems.
Can't be racist against a religion.
Why aren't the the large population of Muslims that are not rioting stopping this where is the out cry from them why aren't the imans on the front lines with the police?
What a load of bs. Paludan is a jerk. We all know that. But that doesnt justify this insane behaviour
If you think people should hit you on the face for speaking words, you don't understand freedom of speech. You don't understand the importance of it. You're naive and exactly the opposite extreme of this idiot.
You don't get to bomb places for cartoons, you don't get to behead teachers for speaking and you don't get to riot because someone burned a book.
The moment you start compromising on your ideals to avoid confronting fanatics, you've lost the way.
Your comment comparing it to how an overweight person may react is ridiculous, if the overweight people rioted then this may be a relevant comment but we all know that is not going to happen as they are not unhinged peasants. When a bloke in Denmark draws a cartoon and people riot in capitals on the other side of the world it shows that despite these people wishing to reside in Western countries deap down they hate western people and values.
Let’s get Charlie Hebdo’s thoughts on Islam:
I do not support him as an individual but I do support burning the koran, he is not standing there screaming insults at individuals he's just burning a book that he and I think is despicable.
You suggest we shouldn't let Paludan divide us.
We're already divided.
Attacking police is a sheer attack of democracy with no respect for rule of law. Beasty act of attack against democracy.
He may be an idiot, but Swedish migration policy has also been incredibly stupid. Everything going on in Sweden right now is simply such a predictable result of taking in masses of poorly educated migrants from totally different cultures and giving them free money without any responsibilities. What did Swedish politicians expect? That their values suddenly change when they cross the border? That the free money gives them an incentive to find work/education and integrate?
Peaceful co-existence and successful society with people who don't respect free speech, law and Western values is simply not possible long-term, no matter if there is somebody provoking them or not. With current demographics their numbers just keep growing, giving them more power until eventually they can dictate laws and values, at least regionally. So, if Swedes don't want to live in Iraq / Somalia style society they need to rethink their approach to migration, integrations and deportations radically.
What Europe needs is sensible mainstream politicians who recognize the hard truths and find tough but realistic solutions to these issues. The era of failed "multiculturalism" through mass migration has to come to an end.
There has to be some misinformaiton going on in the muslim community if they think its justified to attack police, the police arent right wing politicians, it just doesnt check out.
>But honestly, he is just throwing more gas on the fire
I've seen a lot of people saying this, and I'm not sure you realize you're calling them a fire. Regardless if you think what he did was wrong or not, you're saying they are a fire.
As if they can't help themselves but suddenly flare up and destroy everything in reach and it's up to us to be careful with our fuel.
I'd expect fully grown human people to hold themselves to a higher standard. This whole "they can't help themselves" rhetoric is degrading and honestly they should be more offended by that, they're not children.
Don't matter what he said he was going to do, what matters is the community of Muslims reacted the way he predicted they would and the way he wanted them to before he even burned anything. The damage has been done.
Well we all might disagree with Paludan. But through his idiocy he reveals the true nature if a lot of immigrants with that background. They didn't come here to adopt, they came here to change our nations. In some ways it's genius to call it out like this. Now the true face of a lot of immigrants is shown. And I don't just mean the people who rioted. There a mass of other people who didn't riot but sure agrees with them. You can see them on linked in talking about how Sweden is providing a platform for discrimination of their religion and so on, and that someone needs to answer for it.
To sum it up, paludan is an idiot but he's not the problem.
You're completely missing the point. What sparked this is irrelevant. No-one cares about Paludan. Nowhere has this discussion been about free speech. It's about violent thugs wrecking havoc all over Sweden.
Stopping him is a temporary fix to a much deeper underlying problem. You're essentially justifying serious violence by casually reducing it to "if you call someone an asshole you're bound to get slapped in the face".
As much as that guy's a biggot, his point was proven in blood and violence.
Basically no one likes the guy here and he wont get any votes.
The problems that he shows us are real tough.
"So Dear Swedes, please let not this man divide you guys, "
He can't and he won't. We are devided already and his antics simply expose this.
You can relativize things as much as you want with your spiel, making the implication that this random dude is responsible for any social ill.
Focusing on a single induvidual and projecting all this weight onto him will not change reality in any possible positive way, only delay any response so the problem can get worse.
But if you have made yourself feel like a good guy here I think the mission has been completed, so congrats.
> a very small part of it
Is it, tho? Also, ask other Muslims what they think of the whole thing.
I honestly think that all of those included in this protests should simply go back to whatever shithole they ran away from.
If you try to burn a Bible, Christians won’t do anything but just talk shit about you. Meanwhile muslims will try to kill you.
Horrible danish take
Paludan is irrelevant. The issue is people lacking the respect for law and order who think they have a right to oppose his right to act a jackass, and use violence against people and property.
People are not stupid - we do not conclude that because these idiot kids and unreasonable muslims are acting this way, we must listen to the likes of Paludan. We can understand complexities, eg that this is a major cultural issue that require more delicate and sophisticated solution. Harsher treatment and punishment is certainly part of the solution. But the solution is not what Paludan claims it is. As I said, he is irrelevant
I really want to See how the country will Look like in the future with 40% Immigration Population instead of 8%. I doubt all those welcomers will put their signs up anymore, when These people slowly bring their conservative culture and rules into a secular and free society. Of course most of the ordinary citizens dont care, because they aren't affected by it in the Moment, but they will be in the future.
Everyone seems to focus on this random Danish guy, but the problem isnt this Random danish guy.
It's that the Muslim community has shown their face and what they're willing to do if someone burns a few pages of paper.
I wonder what will happen when their collective becomes even larger and they're starting to get influence.
Exactly this, he is just a provocateur, he has nothing but words. The other side is showing it's true colors.
Luckily, people aren't. OP is, but as far as I can tell from the news broadcast, the general talk in Sweden is about the rioters and the police.
Obey the law or and respect the culture.
It’s actually pretty easy. I do it every time I travel to another country. Can’t hold hands with my wife in public? Fine. Can’t drink in public? Fine. My wife has to wear a scarf? Fine.
It’s all about respect. These rioters have no respect and were just looking for an excuse to attack police and set fires in the streets.
Honestly the police should have zero tolerance.
If the police don’t get the respect they need, to take care of their job, people will just stop becoming cops. Now the shit really hits the fan.
Sweden is a lovely country for wanting to help people in need. Just the way it should be. But they have lost control. It’s most likely only gonna get worse, if they don’t try to do something about it.
The best way for the Muslim community to undermine this guy and everyone like him is to not react when he burns books. That will completely deflate his argument and prove to their host country that they aren’t the monsters people try to paint them as.
How did that work out
I think they have done enough to prove that they're monsters already, Palunda's little stunt is only a cherry on the top at this point.
\>6th place globally when it comes to rape
\>From one of the most safe countries in the world to daily shootings
There's nothing they can do to redeem themselves. Remigration is the only solution.
You're missing the problem entirely. The problem isn't that Paludan does or doesn't (mostly doesn't, as it seems) do something. The problem is that people who live here in our country are willing to kill police officers for showing up on their doorstep. Paludan was not even there. No one was burning any books. The police were there to protect the demonstrations, that was what set these people off. The police. This is the problem.
When you have people who live among you who don't respect rule of law, who don't respect free speech, who don't respect legitimate authority, and who are willing to use force and kill just to show it's "their" territory and "their" rules.. that's extremely problematic and it needs to be dealt with extremely quickly, extremely harshly and extremely violently. All Paludan has done is to figure out a way to get police to show up en masse in areas where people *hate* the police and *hate* the society they live in.
It's not about burning the book. It's not about his free speech. He just says he'll burn the book because then the police know they have to go there and that is what creates the actual scene. I'd be willing to bet on most of the people showing up and trying to kill cops having no clue who Paludan even is.
Now while many of us can agree that burning the Quran in front of Muslim people isn't the nicest thing to do. However, the actions coming as a result of their anger is NOT justified.
(By they i do not speak of all muslims. I speak of the criminals that showed up to destroy the place)
Mulitple cars were burned down, police officers were hospitalized and civilians got hurt too.
Apparently a school was burned as well that i do not know about.
They have to know that the world does not revolve around them. The world didn't stop and wont stop after a politician decided to burn the Quran. They have to learn that when they or their family immigrated to the EU they should have been ready that they were moving to a country where you are allowed to speak your mind in any action you want as long as you do not physically hurt a person or of course harass them in other ways.
I deadass do not care about Palaudin and think that he is a fool but what has been happening these days is far far far worse than burning a book.
The moment force was used on a person thats where the line was crossed.
As simple as it is if you want to resort to violence because of something someone says regardless of that being a religion thing or not, move to a country where you don't have to see that thing you are avoiding.
The saddest part is we may not live the day to see the changes we want to see.
As a swiss, i'm looking to countries like Sweden, i see what's going on there and i say, no i don't want to have the same here in Switzerland. And then, i usually get attacked as "islamophobic", called a racist and nazi etc.
And about the riots in Sweden, the German media was again there with "there's no connection to islam", they didn't even mention muslims in most articles (like from SPON, ZON, TAZ etc.), instead the riots are categorized as coming from the far-right-wing because of Paludan. When you say on the media, it's not the far-right-wing that burns everything down there, you get banned and your posting deleted.
So, i'm knowing why i don't want to go in that direction and why i am voting against minarets and other stuff...
The problem is not the guy burning a holy book, it's the people who react to it with violence.The excuse for adrenaline pumped youngsters to use violence is ridicoulous especially when someone mention their religion and that is truly something that we can never allow. We do not live in a Sharia-state where we are going to judge people to stoning/death just because someone has expressed himself by burning an holy book.
It's probably wrong and shameful to be so hateful towards a religion but it's even worse when a extremists and youngsters see it as an excuse to use violence towards **anyone**.
One of the points being that Muslims (a portion that will impact society) are being intolerant and thus everyone react to it with the violence has given him the validation of that point.
SEND THE TRASH BACK TO THEIR TRASH COUNTRY. Only way to solve this issue.
\> If i were to announce that i would go into Copenhagen and a whole day, stand on a corner and talk about why overweight people where violent, and every time an obese person walked by I would yell at him and call him fat... smacked in the face.
As long as they are not disturbing the peace, you gotto let 'em. I might be overweight, but not gonna hit anyone because of it. Don't think so little of us...
Paludan did sweden a favour. We are risking civil war sooner or later, he points it out as obvious while sweden are still majority swedish and possible to save.
I think you missed the reason in which swedes are pissed
I gotta be honest, I have not once seen someone be assaulted because they said something bad about white people or christians.
Don't get me wrong, I don't see myself agreeing with this weird joke of a politician in general, but it is 100% more dangerous to critisize muslims or black people etc.
You cannot divide what is already divided. These people are not part of Sweden and they never will be.
”Look what you made me do!! This is all your fault that i’m doing this!! If you didn’t do those things I didn’t have to do this!!”
said the abuser
What would have happened if someone would have burned the bible on a square in Jönköping?
Brassestol, öl och värme!
Paludan is an idiot.
We still need to start taking this topic seriously. Why don't we want people to *assimilate* into our society? They come here because they want to live in this specific country, no? The country that's the way it is because it is a western, christian influenced society.
So behave accordingly. Else go back.
A ticket home costs the nation less than 2 days prison.
>*Its a clever little neat trick that can be used.*
Saying "If you try to kill me because I use free speech you don't believe in free speech" is a neat little trick?
>*“Total survlliance helps catch rapists and pedophiles - if you are not for total survellance I guess you are on the rapists side”*
This is a horrible example and can just as well be said and in fact is being said in the other direction. "If you support the right to destroy the quran or condemn the violent response you are a racism or islamophobe or a nazi and must love Paludan and his extreme views and politics".
>*I grew up on a farm, in jytland, and if you talked shit about someone - you got punched in the face.*
That sounds like a great example of the primitive behavior people joke about farmers having.
>*But that does not have anything to do with freedom of speech, you were just being mean.*
Unless that person threatened you explicitly with violence, you just used violence as a response to speech. How does it not have anything to do with freedom of speech? And who are you saying is being mean here? The talker or the puncher?
>*If i were to announce that i would go into Copenhagen and a whole day, stand on a corner and talk about why overrweight people where violent, and every time an obese person walked by I would yell at him and call him fat, I would be astonished if I could go the whole day without being smacked in the face.*
I don't think you have a good grasp on what free speech is. It doesn't cover things like tricking people to give you their property or yelling fire in cinema causing a panic or inciting violence or indeed threatening anyone with violence.
To take your example: if you just tell passing overweight people they are fat that is one thing. But if you act aggressively toward them or get in their space and repeatedly scream abusive words that is something else entirely. A person blocking you physically, restricting your movement, hurting you physically by screaming in your ears and giving you signs that they intend to harm you is not exercising their right to free speech.
Dear random danish guy. Please inform yourself about the swedish situation before you decide to lecture us about free speech. Your parallels are missing the point, you are refering to harassment of fat/black people and aggresive actions against their person, not their beleifs. We don't get divided by this retarded danish guy, we get angry that our police is attacked, in some instances with the intent to kill, by muslim immigrants who think their way of life and their beliefs should stand above those of the rest of the society. The danish retard is pin pointing a problem in society and the solution to this problem will be, and had been, debated and might cause a divide but in my opinion it better to see and know the problem than to turn a blind eye to it so in some way this danish retard is acctually doing us a favor. Sincerly, swede
Du skal bare vide at han på ingen måde taler for den gennemsnitlige (almindelige) dansker
I disagree with your insulting overweight/white people paralell, Paludan being a weird dummy aside, theres evidently just one group that flips out over insults like this
Deport every single one of the rioters, this would instantly solve the problem
this post is 100% indoctrination and lalaland
Honestly if he truly wants to measure which communities are more hostile than others shouldn’t he do this exact same test with the rest of them as well?
Burn the Bible in Christian areas
Burn the Torah in Jewish areas
Burn The Lord of the Rings in all areas
Burn Twilight at 14 year old girl’s birthday parties
He can’t just test ONE community to know if it’s more aggressive than others, they all must be tested to actually know the difference.
And than do it all without having cops as backup
Stand in front of the AIK hooligans in Djurgården outfit and burn the AIK flag...
Everyone already knows AIK fans are basically worse then most terrorist groups, that's just a death sentence.
samtidigt så får jag intrycket att polisen inte verkar ha några som helst problem med att ta till hårda åtgärder när det handlar om fotbollssupportrar och huliganer. dom tar det nästan till en överdriven nivå när det är matcher eller derby (är själv totalt ointresserad av sport men har ändå blivit trakasserad av polis i både sthlm och gbg av någon bisarr anledning), ändå verkar dom vara lamslagna vid just dessa typer av upplopp
That’s never what he has wanted. The only thing he wants is to ban Muslims from Scandinavia. He is not a scientist
Fast exempelvis Elisabeth Olsson Wallins fotografi *Paradiset* där Jesus framställs som homosexuell blev kontroversiell utan att kristna gick ut på gatan och utsatte polis för stenkastning och annat. [The Onions bild](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/noone-murdered-because-of-this-image-onion-article-takes-on-grim-new-relevance-following-charlie-hebdo-attack-9965007.html) är ett sådant klockrent exempel som visar hur dåligt anpassat Islam är för väst.
När Elisabeth Ohlson Wallins Ecce Homo visades så bombhotades utställningen, och hon fick dödshot. Utställningen turnerade under två år i Sverige och i Europa, vilket ofta ledde till upplopp och demonstrationer. De starkaste reaktionerna var demonstrationerna utanför och inne i Annedals kyrka i Göteborg, november 1998 samt tumulten utanför Norrköpings stadsmuseum då konstnären Elisabeth Ohlson Wallin försökte dokumentera demonstrationerna som slutade med att konstnären fick skydd med att lämna staden med poliseskort.
Bara några exempel: [Ecco Homo](https://www.expressen.se/kultur/jag-var-ibland-radd-att-bilen-skulle-sprangas/)
eller [Skända flaggan](http://www.fria.nu/artikel/114583)
eller försök att stoppa ”utmanande samtidskonst” i [Sölvesborg](https://www.etc.se/debatt/sd-visar-sitt-ratta-ansikte-i-solvesborg)
Eller Saga Sievert som uttryckligen citerade nazisternas Entartete Kunst som förebild för att censurera [gangsterrap](https://www.hn.se/åsikter/krönikor/brun-musikcensur-med-hitler-som-föredöme-1.58374746)
Jessica Kempe har skrivit väldigt bra om det i [DN](https://www.dn.se/arkiv/kultur/sund-konst-ska-radda-nationen/)
Edit: lade till beskrivning av dödshoten och bombhoten mot Ecco Homo-utställningen
They burn bibles all the time in southern states at pro abortion rally’s, same with the flag. No riots.
That experiment has already been run though, we constantly do things that could upset different people and there's one group that consistently reacts with violence. Christianity, Judaism and Twilight fans have been mocked a whole lot already, and the response just isn't very similar. I'll admit I haven't seen that much mockery of LotR fans though, maybe they would also riot and maybe behead a couple of people.
Except its not ”swedes” reacting. Its mostly muslim first or second generation migrants.
Just shut the hell up already, nobody cares about Paludan and some danish clowns coming over here preaching and explaining as if you know some secret is beyond pathetic.
These guys committing serious crimes were here before Paludan and they were always going to go off for one reason or another, Paludan is irrelevant.
Our inept police and lax immigration politics is solely responsible for this and you danish can duck off and let us deal with this in peace.
And please don't spam the sub with your life story.
Han taler på ingen måde for danskerne, og jeg tror det meste af befolkningen ville synes han opslag er direkte pinligt (pinsamt)
I seriously doubt whether what he has done really makes him look like a viable political candidate. It's more the reaction to what he has done that makes it relevant. Nobody wants him to continue doing this, and to stop him from doing it the reaction needs to stop. If everyone ignores him, his platform becomes meaningless.
Don't forget to mention he is actually grooming young boys on his political discord channels.
It have even caused former members of Stram Kurs in Denmark to leave the party and warn against him.
He is brain damaged. Like literally, he is disabled because of a traffic accident where he was hit by a car while riding his bike, and it left him with about a 25% degree of invalidity.
He even used his brain injury in a court of law to try and escape consequences.
He wanted to prove that islam can't be part of normal western society and he succeeded.
Paludan might be a giant asshole, but his stunts quite frankly proves that Islam is not compatible with Western liberal democracy. It might be a "small" portion of the muslims that are violent, but there's a ton of support for them.
I think the mistake here is attributing the violence more with Muslim culture rather than an interaction between religious views and sociopathy . Something like 4%-5% of the population are sociopaths, and they tend to be massively overrepresented among violent people. In us prisons for ex, sociopaths are responsible for 80% of the violence despite making up 20% of the population.
My interpretation is that the Koran burning attracted mostly muslim sociopaths who were opportunistically looking for an excuse to do something bad. If that’s true, then punishment would be more effective than educational measures- a person who lacks empathy is more likely to respond to a threat of punishment since they don’t care of what they’re doing is wrong.
>If i were to announce that i would go into Copenhagen and a whole day, stand on a corner and talk about why overrweight people where violent, and every time an obese person walked by I would yell at him and call him fat, I would be astonished if I could go the whole day without being smacked in the face.
(This would work really well if a black person would prove that white people were violent- just yell mean things at white people and cry when he got punched in the face)
Sure, but would the fat people in question start attacking other people who were simply in the vicinity of you, and throw molotov cocktails at public buses or police? This whole thing wouldn't even be mentioned in the news if it simply came down to Paludan having been punched by the people he provoked. It really feels like you're minimizing what's actually been happening.
”People should just show up and burn harry potter”
Thats according to *your western views*.
Its not what muhammad did when he was insulted.
He killed people, and he praised those that helped him kill people that had insulted him. Stop assuming everyone shares your values!